The U @ BC Must-Win Wed. Night 7 pm

[BCEagle74]

Still trying to comprehend how wins in ACC Tourney >>>> Wins in NCAA tourney.

Winning a conference championship is better than everything other than a Final Four appearance. The fact that people continually attribute some level accomplishment to the 15 teams that fail to win the championship still mystifies me. Actually, it doesn't. The Sweet 16 was chosen because it is where Al's success ended. If Al never made the 32, that would be the line. If Al had 4 Sweet 16s, but never went further, than the Elite Eight would be the line.

Fact is that winning your conference makes you a conference champion. Winning a round of 32 game makes you one of 16 teams that won a round of 32 game. The former gets you remembered as the winner of one of the best conferences in America, the latter gets you forgotten.

Unless you are one of the final four, winning games in the tournament <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<winning conference championship in Big East or ACC.

Bullshit.

Lots of teams tank in the Conference Championships to save their legs for the NCAA??????

The only thing the regular season and conference championships are for now is a giant seeding process and the conference Championships are for teams like BC who have to win 2-3 or more to get a seed ---- or actually win the Tourney to get in the BIG DANCE!

The Final 68 is the deal. The Conference Championship was like you say in the past....no more now 9.

No more now!! The Season starts when the 68 go for the Bunny! Move into the real world tehre youngin!!

[twballgame9]

Still trying to comprehend how wins in ACC Tourney >>>> Wins in NCAA tourney.

Winning a conference championship is better than everything other than a Final Four appearance. The fact that people continually attribute some level accomplishment to the 15 teams that fail to win the championship still mystifies me. Actually, it doesn't. The Sweet 16 was chosen because it is where Al's success ended. If Al never made the 32, that would be the line. If Al had 4 Sweet 16s, but never went further, than the Elite Eight would be the line.

Fact is that winning your conference makes you a conference champion. Winning a round of 32 game makes you one of 16 teams that won a round of 32 game. The former gets you remembered as the winner of one of the best conferences in America, the latter gets you forgotten.

Unless you are one of the final four, winning games in the tournament <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<winning conference championship in Big East or ACC.

Bullshit.

Lots of teams tank in the Conference Championships to save their legs for the NCAA??????

The only thing the regular season and conference championships are for now is a giant seeding process and the conference Championships are for teams like BC who have to win 2-3 or more to get a seed ---- or actually win the Tourney to get in the BIG DANCE!

The Final 68 is the deal. The Conference Championship was like you say in the past....no more now 9.

No more now!! The Season starts when the 68 go for the Bunny! Move into the real world tehre youngin!!

Bullshit. I will trade one ACC title for any number of Sweet 16 Appearances. Think about it, you clowns are excited about something called "appearances". Which is apropos, because for you clowns, appearances is what it is all about. At least for the 15 seconds that being in the Sweet 16 is relevant.

[BCEagle74]

The conference title tournament for the ACC and other conferences means one thing ---that have the automatic qualifier rule for teams on the bubble, below the bubble and teams like BC, now out........ they win that conference tourney to do what???

do do do do do do do............ a little Jepoardy music.....

THEY GET INTO THE NCAA's?????

MCFLY??? BUELLER???

Brackets... no one cares about the leather patch on some jacket anymore?

[bcmurph]

Bullshit. I will trade one ACC title for any number of Sweet 16 Appearances

To get either you're gonna need some good players...Which do you think is more important in terms of recruiting and exposure?

[claver2010]

Still trying to comprehend how wins in ACC Tourney >>>> Wins in NCAA tourney.

Winning a conference championship is better than everything other than a Final Four appearance. The fact that people continually attribute some level accomplishment to the 15 teams that fail to win the championship still mystifies me. Actually, it doesn't. The Sweet 16 was chosen because it is where Al's success ended. If Al never made the 32, that would be the line. If Al had 4 Sweet 16s, but never went further, than the Elite Eight would be the line.

Fact is that winning your conference makes you a conference champion. Winning a round of 32 game makes you one of 16 teams that won a round of 32 game. The former gets you remembered as the winner of one of the best conferences in America, the latter gets you forgotten.

Unless you are one of the final four, winning games in the tournament <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<winning conference championship in Big East or ACC.

The whole argument is that Skinner blew chunks when he got to the tourney. You can set whatever "arbitrary" line you want, his teams consistently underperformed -even that Sweet 16 team with 3 1st rounders was pretty damn close to losing to a 13 seed.

By the way, the middle of the road BE team of which you speak is less than a year removed from a Final Four and currently has something like 6 top 50 RPI wins and SOS of 4. Oh and they're better than 80% of the ACC.

The kid hasn't played more than 5 minutes since 12/1 and hasn't gotten into a conf game all year.

[eepstein0]

(1) None of Al's recruits have done anything productive at other schools
(2) Evan Ravanel would not have been eligible I don't think by basketball season anyway. I have no idea why Ohio State wants him because he's not very good either.

This team would have won 21 or 22 games under Skinner even with his crappy, Hewitt/Purnell type coaching and lost in the First Round. I don't know why people around here are all excited about that. The team would not have contended for an ACC Championship and certainly weren't going anywhere in the NCAA Tournament.

TWB is correct that they canned Skinner because after this year it would have been harder to fire him. But honestly, GDF made the right move. That type of season is nice and all, but doesn't really accomplish anything as far as trying to put this program on the map. This program, under Al harnessed some of his magic from early in his tenure (a.k.a. hiring component assistant coaches assistant coaches, went back to finding diamonds in the rough type kids, etc.) was going nowhere.

So essentially I actually agree with TWB, but getting rid of Al was still a great move because I really like Donahue Miami X2 performances aside.

[pick6pedro]

(1) None of Al's recruits have done anything productive at other schools
(2) Evan Ravanel would not have been eligible I don't think by basketball season anyway. I have no idea why Ohio State wants him because he's not very good either.

This team would have won 21 or 22 games under Skinner even with his crappy, Hewitt/Purnell type coaching and lost in the First Round. I don't know why people around here are all excited about that. The team would not have contended for an ACC Championship and certainly weren't going anywhere in the NCAA Tournament.

TWB is correct that they canned Skinner because after this year it would have been harder to fire him. But honestly, GDF made the right move. That type of season is nice and all, but doesn't really accomplish anything as far as trying to put this program on the map. This program, under Al harnessed some of his magic from early in his tenure (a.k.a. hiring component assistant coaches assistant coaches, went back to finding diamonds in the rough type kids, etc.) was going nowhere.

So essentially I actually agree with TWB, but getting rid of Al was still a great move because I really like Donahue Miami X2 performances aside.

Remove that line and I pretty much agree with everything. Well everything except maybe Ravenel's potential (and maybe he won't fill a huge need at OSU, but if you don't think BC could have used another big man who was showing signs of all-around improvement, I don't know what to tell you). No one is saying they are all excited Al would have gotten to 22 wins or so - they're saying that's what was likely to happen if he and all the pieces remained. Not sure why emotion has to come into play in these discussions where the very people saying Al would have won more go on to say they are glad to have the Don on campus because it's about more than just a couple more wins in one season.

[eepstein0]

(1) None of Al's recruits have done anything productive at other schools
(2) Evan Ravanel would not have been eligible I don't think by basketball season anyway. I have no idea why Ohio State wants him because he's not very good either.

This team would have won 21 or 22 games under Skinner even with his crappy, Hewitt/Purnell type coaching and lost in the First Round. I don't know why people around here are all excited about that. The team would not have contended for an ACC Championship and certainly weren't going anywhere in the NCAA Tournament.

TWB is correct that they canned Skinner because after this year it would have been harder to fire him. But honestly, GDF made the right move. That type of season is nice and all, but doesn't really accomplish anything as far as trying to put this program on the map. This program, under Al harnessed some of his magic from early in his tenure (a.k.a. hiring component assistant coaches assistant coaches, went back to finding diamonds in the rough type kids, etc.) was going nowhere.

So essentially I actually agree with TWB, but getting rid of Al was still a great move because I really like Donahue Miami X2 performances aside.

Remove that line and I pretty much agree with everything. Well everything except maybe Ravenel's potential (and maybe he won't fill a huge need at OSU, but if you don't think BC could have used another big man who was showing signs of all-around improvement, I don't know what to tell you). No one is saying they are all excited Al would have gotten to 22 wins or so - they're saying that's what was likely to happen if he and all the pieces remained. Not sure why emotion has to come into play in these discussions where the very people saying Al would have won more go on to say they are glad to have the Don on campus because it's about more than just a couple more wins in one season.

EVAN RAVANEL AVERAGED 3.3 POINTS AND 2.4 REBOUNDS PER GAME. Even late in the year he was awful. He scored a whopping 8 points and 3 rebounds against UNC which was his best ACC game. Ravanel essentially = Courtney Dunn. If Dunn is healthy, he should be playing more minutes on this team btw. I'd again rather run him out there for 20 minutes as Southern's sub instead of the parade of walk-ons we run out there.

[pick6pedro]

(1) None of Al's recruits have done anything productive at other schools
(2) Evan Ravanel would not have been eligible I don't think by basketball season anyway. I have no idea why Ohio State wants him because he's not very good either.

This team would have won 21 or 22 games under Skinner even with his crappy, Hewitt/Purnell type coaching and lost in the First Round. I don't know why people around here are all excited about that. The team would not have contended for an ACC Championship and certainly weren't going anywhere in the NCAA Tournament.

TWB is correct that they canned Skinner because after this year it would have been harder to fire him. But honestly, GDF made the right move. That type of season is nice and all, but doesn't really accomplish anything as far as trying to put this program on the map. This program, under Al harnessed some of his magic from early in his tenure (a.k.a. hiring component assistant coaches assistant coaches, went back to finding diamonds in the rough type kids, etc.) was going nowhere.

So essentially I actually agree with TWB, but getting rid of Al was still a great move because I really like Donahue Miami X2 performances aside.

Remove that line and I pretty much agree with everything. Well everything except maybe Ravenel's potential (and maybe he won't fill a huge need at OSU, but if you don't think BC could have used another big man who was showing signs of all-around improvement, I don't know what to tell you). No one is saying they are all excited Al would have gotten to 22 wins or so - they're saying that's what was likely to happen if he and all the pieces remained. Not sure why emotion has to come into play in these discussions where the very people saying Al would have won more go on to say they are glad to have the Don on campus because it's about more than just a couple more wins in one season.

EVAN RAVANEL AVERAGED 3.3 POINTS AND 2.4 REBOUNDS PER GAME. Even late in the year he was awful. He scored a whopping 8 points and 3 rebounds against UNC which was his best ACC game. Ravanel essentially = Courtney Dunn. If Dunn is healthy, he should be playing more minutes on this team btw. I'd again rather run him out there for 20 minutes as Southern's sub instead of the parade of walk-ons we run out there.

As a sophomore who had played a total of like 70 minutes as a frosh. He was also only taking 2.5 shots per game. I saw improvement in his footwork in the low post, his confidence with the ball, as well as away from the ball and positioning on defense. But he only had 3.3 ppg, so I guess he wasn't improving. Having Trap and Southern as your only guys on the court over 6'6'' is just fine, though, right?

[eepstein0]

(1) None of Al's recruits have done anything productive at other schools
(2) Evan Ravanel would not have been eligible I don't think by basketball season anyway. I have no idea why Ohio State wants him because he's not very good either.

This team would have won 21 or 22 games under Skinner even with his crappy, Hewitt/Purnell type coaching and lost in the First Round. I don't know why people around here are all excited about that. The team would not have contended for an ACC Championship and certainly weren't going anywhere in the NCAA Tournament.

TWB is correct that they canned Skinner because after this year it would have been harder to fire him. But honestly, GDF made the right move. That type of season is nice and all, but doesn't really accomplish anything as far as trying to put this program on the map. This program, under Al harnessed some of his magic from early in his tenure (a.k.a. hiring component assistant coaches assistant coaches, went back to finding diamonds in the rough type kids, etc.) was going nowhere.

So essentially I actually agree with TWB, but getting rid of Al was still a great move because I really like Donahue Miami X2 performances aside.

Remove that line and I pretty much agree with everything. Well everything except maybe Ravenel's potential (and maybe he won't fill a huge need at OSU, but if you don't think BC could have used another big man who was showing signs of all-around improvement, I don't know what to tell you). No one is saying they are all excited Al would have gotten to 22 wins or so - they're saying that's what was likely to happen if he and all the pieces remained. Not sure why emotion has to come into play in these discussions where the very people saying Al would have won more go on to say they are glad to have the Don on campus because it's about more than just a couple more wins in one season.

EVAN RAVANEL AVERAGED 3.3 POINTS AND 2.4 REBOUNDS PER GAME. Even late in the year he was awful. He scored a whopping 8 points and 3 rebounds against UNC which was his best ACC game. Ravanel essentially = Courtney Dunn. If Dunn is healthy, he should be playing more minutes on this team btw. I'd again rather run him out there for 20 minutes as Southern's sub instead of the parade of walk-ons we run out there.

As a sophomore who had played a total of like 70 minutes as a frosh. He was also only taking 2.5 shots per game. I saw improvement in his footwork in the low post, his confidence with the ball, as well as away from the ball and positioning on defense. But he only had 3.3 ppg, so I guess he wasn't improving. Having Trap and Southern as your only guys on the court over 6'6'' is just fine, though, right?

If you want someone who just stands out there and takes up space that's a wide body and over 6'6", put this guy out there.

[pick6pedro]

(1) None of Al's recruits have done anything productive at other schools
(2) Evan Ravanel would not have been eligible I don't think by basketball season anyway. I have no idea why Ohio State wants him because he's not very good either.

This team would have won 21 or 22 games under Skinner even with his crappy, Hewitt/Purnell type coaching and lost in the First Round. I don't know why people around here are all excited about that. The team would not have contended for an ACC Championship and certainly weren't going anywhere in the NCAA Tournament.

TWB is correct that they canned Skinner because after this year it would have been harder to fire him. But honestly, GDF made the right move. That type of season is nice and all, but doesn't really accomplish anything as far as trying to put this program on the map. This program, under Al harnessed some of his magic from early in his tenure (a.k.a. hiring component assistant coaches assistant coaches, went back to finding diamonds in the rough type kids, etc.) was going nowhere.

So essentially I actually agree with TWB, but getting rid of Al was still a great move because I really like Donahue Miami X2 performances aside.

Remove that line and I pretty much agree with everything. Well everything except maybe Ravenel's potential (and maybe he won't fill a huge need at OSU, but if you don't think BC could have used another big man who was showing signs of all-around improvement, I don't know what to tell you). No one is saying they are all excited Al would have gotten to 22 wins or so - they're saying that's what was likely to happen if he and all the pieces remained. Not sure why emotion has to come into play in these discussions where the very people saying Al would have won more go on to say they are glad to have the Don on campus because it's about more than just a couple more wins in one season.

EVAN RAVANEL AVERAGED 3.3 POINTS AND 2.4 REBOUNDS PER GAME. Even late in the year he was awful. He scored a whopping 8 points and 3 rebounds against UNC which was his best ACC game. Ravanel essentially = Courtney Dunn. If Dunn is healthy, he should be playing more minutes on this team btw. I'd again rather run him out there for 20 minutes as Southern's sub instead of the parade of walk-ons we run out there.

As a sophomore who had played a total of like 70 minutes as a frosh. He was also only taking 2.5 shots per game. I saw improvement in his footwork in the low post, his confidence with the ball, as well as away from the ball and positioning on defense. But he only had 3.3 ppg, so I guess he wasn't improving. Having Trap and Southern as your only guys on the court over 6'6'' is just fine, though, right?

If you want someone who just stands out there and takes up space that's a wide body and over 6'6", put this guy out there.

Again, he was showing signs of improvement and comfort. You think he'd just be a guy to take up space and 3.3 points tells you all you need to know. Meanwhile I think he'd provide better minutes than many of the current options for a team that is severely lacking at the position - which only serves to increase the value of the minutes he would provide. Why exactly did Thad Matta want him?

[claver2010]

Again, he was showing signs of improvement and comfort. You think he'd just be a guy to take up space and 3.3 points tells you all you need to know. Meanwhile I think he'd provide better minutes than many of the current options for a team that is severely lacking at the position - which only serves to increase the value of the minutes he would provide. Why exactly did Thad Matta want him?

You are assuming he gets on the floor. Unless he moved his GPA into the positive range it wasn't happening.

[eepstein0]

Again, he was showing signs of improvement and comfort. You think he'd just be a guy to take up space and 3.3 points tells you all you need to know. Meanwhile I think he'd provide better minutes than many of the current options for a team that is severely lacking at the position - which only serves to increase the value of the minutes he would provide. Why exactly did Thad Matta want him?

You are assuming he gets on the floor. Unless he moved his GPA into the positive range it wasn't happening.

0.3 doesn't make you eligible last time I checked. Maybe at OSU...

[pick6pedro]

Again, he was showing signs of improvement and comfort. You think he'd just be a guy to take up space and 3.3 points tells you all you need to know. Meanwhile I think he'd provide better minutes than many of the current options for a team that is severely lacking at the position - which only serves to increase the value of the minutes he would provide. Why exactly did Thad Matta want him?

You are assuming he gets on the floor. Unless he moved his GPA into the positive range it wasn't happening.

Why should his GPA matter when discussing whether he could be useful if available? He's not on the team anymore, which is hampering his play for BC as much as failing grades, but that doesn't change the fact that we could still use him. Am I wrong- was he not improving and showing some promise? Neither of you seem to address this.

[Cadillac90]

Again, he was showing signs of improvement and comfort. You think he'd just be a guy to take up space and 3.3 points tells you all you need to know. Meanwhile I think he'd provide better minutes than many of the current options for a team that is severely lacking at the position - which only serves to increase the value of the minutes he would provide. Why exactly did Thad Matta want him?

You are assuming he gets on the floor. Unless he moved his GPA into the positive range it wasn't happening.

Why should his GPA matter when discussing whether he could be useful if available? He's not on the team anymore, which is hampering his play for BC as much as failing grades, but that doesn't change the fact that we could still use him. Am I wrong- was he not improving and showing some promise? Neither of you seem to address this.

Simple, his GPA matters because he was recruited by Al Skinner therefore there's no way he can contribute to any program.

[claver2010]

Again, he was showing signs of improvement and comfort. You think he'd just be a guy to take up space and 3.3 points tells you all you need to know. Meanwhile I think he'd provide better minutes than many of the current options for a team that is severely lacking at the position - which only serves to increase the value of the minutes he would provide. Why exactly did Thad Matta want him?

You are assuming he gets on the floor. Unless he moved his GPA into the positive range it wasn't happening.

Why should his GPA matter when discussing whether he could be useful if available? He's not on the team anymore, which is hampering his play for BC as much as failing grades, but that doesn't change the fact that we could still use him. Am I wrong- was he not improving and showing some promise? Neither of you seem to address this.

His GPA matters because if it didn't improve it wouldn't matter whether he stayed at BC.

Yes, if he was academically eligible and he continued improving or carried over the results off a 6 game sample of a 60 career, he would be of use.

[bcmurph]

By the way, the middle of the road BE team of which you speak is less than a year removed from a Final Four and currently has something like 6 top 50 RPI wins and SOS of 4. Oh and they're better than 80% of the ACC.

The kid hasn't played more than 5 minutes since 12/1 and hasn't gotten into a conf game all year.[/quote]

If we're talking about Noreen, he's hurt...had surgery, IIRC

[eepstein0]

By the way, the middle of the road BE team of which you speak is less than a year removed from a Final Four and currently has something like 6 top 50 RPI wins and SOS of 4. Oh and they're better than 80% of the ACC.

The kid hasn't played more than 5 minutes since 12/1 and hasn't gotten into a conf game all year.

If we're talking about Noreen, he's hurt...had surgery, IIRC[/quote]

Yea he is injured. BTW whichever one of you pointed out the naming similarity between that Penguin and the PF on our basketball team is my new hero.

[pick6pedro]

His GPA matters because if it didn't improve it wouldn't matter whether he stayed at BC.

Yes, if he was academically eligible and he continued improving or carried over the results off a 6 game sample of a 60 career, he would be of use.

He qualified for two seasons, so forgive me for thinking he may be able to play another. 60 games? Try 39. At 400 total minutes. C'mon, enough hyperbole. You still haven't refuted that he was improving or showing some value towards the end of his BC career or what Matta sees in him.

[MilitantEagle]

His GPA matters because if it didn't improve it wouldn't matter whether he stayed at BC.

Yes, if he was academically eligible and he continued improving or carried over the results off a 6 game sample of a 60 career, he would be of use.

He qualified for two seasons, so forgive me for thinking he may be able to play another. 60 games? Try 39. At 400 total minutes. C'mon, enough hyperbole. You still haven't refuted that he was improving or showing some value towards the end of his BC career or what Matta sees in him.

(TobaccoRoadEagle and twballgame, please don't read, I am going to mention Skinner.) I recall being a little confused and slightly annoyed that Evan was not getting more minutes last year. In my opinion, when he was in there, he looked much better than Southern and Dunn, but Skinner wouldn't play him. I couldn't figure it out.

[claver2010]

His GPA matters because if it didn't improve it wouldn't matter whether he stayed at BC.

Yes, if he was academically eligible and he continued improving or carried over the results off a 6 game sample of a 60 career, he would be of use.

He qualified for two seasons, so forgive me for thinking he may be able to play another. 60 games? Try 39. At 400 total minutes. C'mon, enough hyperbole. You still haven't refuted that he was improving or showing some value towards the end of his BC career or what Matta sees in him.

This argument is retarded -we've devoted as much time to a guy who never scored more than 8 points in any game in 2 years.

1) He wasn't eligible 2nd semester FR year
2) He was a DNP for 1/3 of his games at BC
3) We're discussing a guy who scored a grand total of 110 points in 2 years

Could we use him? Sure, he transferred for whatever reason

Did he show improvement? Yes. I'm just not losing sleep over losing him.

[pick6pedro]

His GPA matters because if it didn't improve it wouldn't matter whether he stayed at BC.

Yes, if he was academically eligible and he continued improving or carried over the results off a 6 game sample of a 60 career, he would be of use.

He qualified for two seasons, so forgive me for thinking he may be able to play another. 60 games? Try 39. At 400 total minutes. C'mon, enough hyperbole. You still haven't refuted that he was improving or showing some value towards the end of his BC career or what Matta sees in him.

This argument is retarded -we've devoted as much time to a guy who never scored more than 8 points in any game in 2 years.

1) He wasn't eligible 2nd semester FR year
2) He was a DNP for 1/3 of his games at BC
3) We're discussing a guy who scored a grand total of 110 points in 2 years

Could we use him? Sure, he transferred for whatever reason

Did he show improvement? Yes. I'm just not losing sleep over losing him.

I agree so I don't want to dwell on this. No one is losing sleep, but sorry if I look at it as more than his ppg.

[Eagledom]

if only at some point in the season some strong, tough, handsome (and not at all fat) poster had pointed out that no game for this team should be counted as a win or that any team this inconsistent could beat any team (dook excluded) and lose to any team (wake included). that person would have gotten these hoops weirdos in the proper frame of mind to try to enjoy the season without any unrealistic expectations of ncaa tournaments.

if there had been such a person, i would slide an envelope addressed to him with $1,000 in it under the door of the eo lounge right about now...

Hmmm, those expectations are not looking so unrealistic now are they?

[twballgame9]

if only at some point in the season some strong, tough, handsome (and not at all fat) poster had pointed out that no game for this team should be counted as a win or that any team this inconsistent could beat any team (dook excluded) and lose to any team (wake included). that person would have gotten these hoops weirdos in the proper frame of mind to try to enjoy the season without any unrealistic expectations of ncaa tournaments.

if there had been such a person, i would slide an envelope addressed to him with $1,000 in it under the door of the eo lounge right about now...

Hmmm, those expectations are not looking so unrealistic now are they?

please note - no one here should make a prediction EVER. if you do, oj will be there to point out that your prediction, assumption, estimate, guess, or assertion was WRONG. don't worry, though... you can't do the same in return because oj never takes a position on anything other than washington crapitals hockey and that al skinner didn't get past the sweet 16

ps fire al

Please note: I predicted this team would win 20 games. I said the team SHOULD win 20 games.

Thanks in advance. (and yes I was wrong about Wake - they are so terrible there is no chance for a WTF).