Setting the timeline for success

[bapst]

Class of 1984, long-time lurker on the Scout site... first post on the Outsider board.

After losing essentially another class of recruits over the past few days, what are your expectations for next few seasons? I'm assuming NCAA is expanding to 96 teams. Here's mine:

Spring 2010: bring in at least 2-3 recruits who are potentially ACC caliber. Rather leave spots empty than fill them in with 2nd team all New Hampshire types.

2010-2011: Build the team around Reggie and Trapani. Want to see a team in shape, playing hard, and can successfully inbound the basketball. Raji and Elmore as competent 3rd and 4th options. Coach Southern up, and see if he has any talent and will to justify the offers he had coming out of high school. Hope at least one of the recruits (juco, maybe?) can make a meaningful contribution. Expect overall attendance to be lousy, but a noticeable increase in students coming out to the games. Win ALL of the cupcakes, win at least one non-conference game again decent competition, and finish between 6-8th in ACC. In a 96 team tourney field, that should be good enough to get us in the show. Gone by the first weekend.

2011-2012: Reggie and whomever is around... results a lot like T Rice's senior year. Some of the young guys (names we don't know yet) begin to show some potential. BC marketing begins to (finally!) kick in to gear, and place looks reasonably full for conference games. Pull off a few upsets, endure a WTF loss or two, finish 8-9th in ACC, hoping we can win two games to make it back in the tourney for a cup of coffee. Probably not, but things are looking up.

2012-13: Donahue's footprint is firmly planted at the Heights; the press begins to pay attention to him an an exciting brand of ball. A couple of 4-star recruits are lured in, and BC is considered a big headache on the schedule for rival schools. As the Celtics are now rebuilding, Boston media starts to pay attention to what's going on at the Heights. Eagles surprise by finishing 5th-6th in league play, but team is too young to make it past the first weekend of the NCAA's. Donahue is ACC coach of the year, gets a big raise and an extension.

2013-14: Because of really good sophomore and junior year classes, expectations are high. Conte Forum is full for most games, and crowd is really into it. BC beats out Duke for at least one major recruit. Donahue's guys live up to expectations, finish in the top 3 in the ACC, make it to the championship game, and make a long, long run into the NCAA's. Conversation on this board centers on what BC now needs to make it to the final four. The morale of the program has been fully restored, and the long-term bar of success has been permanently raised. Spaz announces his retirement, and alums clamor for Smilin' Gene to find the "Steve Donahue" of the gridiron.

Anybody ready to get back on board the basketball program?

[apbc12]

I agree with most of this, but the Celtics will be rebuilding earlier than in your timeline.

[BCEagles25]

I like a lot of this too, but I don't think we'll win all of our cupcakes next year. Almost every team has one WTF loss, especially one under a new system with a short bench. And I would be extremely happy if Jackson's senior year went like Rice's. And if that does indeed happen, there will be no 8th-9th ACC finish.

[BCEagle74]

TIMELINE = NOW = MARCH 2011.

SUCCESS: If we are in a field of 96 and ranked 33rd or above and play on Tuesday or Monday, BC will win 4 games and be in the Sweet 16 and maybe the Elite 8 with Stevie D.

1--TRAPANI 6-7 RAVENEL 6-8 SOUTHERN 6-10 (Sore Shoulder healed), DUNN 6-8, and RAJI 6-6, -- will be in game shape and get better this summer and have new attitudes and the other bongettes will have quit which was not enforced after the Chinaman left.

MAybe NADO can be a player right out and you get 6 guys.

2--Paris 6-1, Jackson 6-3 and ELMORE 6-5 should be enough, but one more guard woulda been sweet.

So 30-30-20...big deal. Maybe you get 6 minutes from white gaulks Mosakowski 6-1 and Judge Rehnquist 6-4.

ROLL ME AN 11 to the Title.

NOW is the time for success and turn that into recruiting magic.

[talon]

Reading this board, I've been led to believe that Al Skinner was rock-bottom terrible. Anybody else would have been an improvement and Steve "Anybody Else" Donahue only loses Roche (who everybody agrees sucks) and Sanders (who everyone seems to believe is a clubhouse cancer and his departure is something to celebrate).

So, less than 15 wins next year would be a DISASTER.

Unless the loss of Roche/Sanders isn't a reason to be happy and/or unless Al Skinner was not a rock-bottom terrible coach.

[Eagledom]

I like a lot of this too, but I don't think we'll win all of our cupcakes next year. Almost every team has one WTF loss, especially one under a new system with a short bench. And I would be extremely happy if Jackson's senior year went like Rice's. And if that does indeed happen, there will be no 8th-9th ACC finish.

One? someone needs to tell Al that.

[eepstein0]

Reading this board, I've been led to believe that Al Skinner was rock-bottom terrible. Anybody else would have been an improvement and Steve "Anybody Else" Donahue only loses Roche (who everybody agrees sucks) and Sanders (who everyone seems to believe is a clubhouse cancer and his departure is something to celebrate).

So, less than 15 wins next year would be a DISASTER.

Unless the loss of Roche/Sanders isn't a reason to be happy and/or unless Al Skinner was not a rock-bottom terrible coach.

I think 15 wins is the upside. Losing Roche and Sanders won't hurt the team a ton, but with the talent on board I'm not sure they were going to be very good anyway.

[BCEagle74]

TIMELINE = NOW = MARCH 2011.

SUCCESS: If we are in a field of 96 and ranked 33rd or above and play on Tuesday or Monday, BC will win 4 games and be in the Sweet 16 and maybe the Elite 8 with Stevie D.

1--TRAPANI 6-7 RAVENEL 6-8 SOUTHERN 6-10 (Sore Shoulder healed), DUNN 6-8, and RAJI 6-6, -- will be in game shape and get better this summer and have new attitudes and the other bongettes will have quit which was not enforced after the Chinaman left.

MAybe NADO can be a player right out and you get 6 guys.

2--Paris 6-1, Jackson 6-3 and ELMORE 6-5 should be enough, but one more guard woulda been sweet.

So 30-30-20...big deal. Maybe you get 6 minutes from white gaulks Mosakowski 6-1 and Judge Rehnquist 6-4.

ROLL ME AN 11 to the Title.

NOW is the time for success and turn that into recruiting magic.

When we win at least 3 NCAA Games..someone remind me of this post.

[talon]

Reading this board, I've been led to believe that Al Skinner was rock-bottom terrible. Anybody else would have been an improvement and Steve "Anybody Else" Donahue only loses Roche (who everybody agrees sucks) and Sanders (who everyone seems to believe is a clubhouse cancer and his departure is something to celebrate).

So, less than 15 wins next year would be a DISASTER.

Unless the loss of Roche/Sanders isn't a reason to be happy and/or unless Al Skinner was not a rock-bottom terrible coach.

I think 15 wins is the upside. Losing Roche and Sanders won't hurt the team a ton, but with the talent on board I'm not sure they were going to be very good anyway.

really? Donahue has pretty much the exact same team coming back next year, and you said yourself that ANYBODY would be an upgrade over Skinner and you're predicting a worse year?

[GreenvilleEagle]

Reading this board, I've been led to believe that Al Skinner was rock-bottom terrible. Anybody else would have been an improvement and Steve "Anybody Else" Donahue only loses Roche (who everybody agrees sucks) and Sanders (who everyone seems to believe is a clubhouse cancer and his departure is something to celebrate).
So, less than 15 wins next year would be a DISASTER.

Unless the loss of Roche/Sanders isn't a reason to be happy and/or unless Al Skinner was not a rock-bottom terrible coach.

Do you think Rakim was a good teammate?

[talon]

Reading this board, I've been led to believe that Al Skinner was rock-bottom terrible. Anybody else would have been an improvement and Steve "Anybody Else" Donahue only loses Roche (who everybody agrees sucks) and Sanders (who everyone seems to believe is a clubhouse cancer and his departure is something to celebrate).
So, less than 15 wins next year would be a DISASTER.

Unless the loss of Roche/Sanders isn't a reason to be happy and/or unless Al Skinner was not a rock-bottom terrible coach.

Do you think Rakim was a good teammate?

I don't know. Do you think the team will be better without him?

Because I'm seeing the exact same team coming back next year, minus Roche, minus Sanders (which is addition by subtraction, no?) and getting coached by someone who's apparently significantly better than Skinner and people are acting like duplicating last year's win total next year would be a pleasant surprise.

[Eagledom]

Reading this board, I've been led to believe that Al Skinner was rock-bottom terrible. Anybody else would have been an improvement and Steve "Anybody Else" Donahue only loses Roche (who everybody agrees sucks) and Sanders (who everyone seems to believe is a clubhouse cancer and his departure is something to celebrate).
So, less than 15 wins next year would be a DISASTER.

Unless the loss of Roche/Sanders isn't a reason to be happy and/or unless Al Skinner was not a rock-bottom terrible coach.

Do you think Rakim was a good teammate?

now that's funny. You lose a starter (who never lived up to his hype/potential, but still scored 12 points a game) and don't replace him, and you are supposed to be a better team. Gotta love the skinner lovers. so if a really bad baseball team loses a mediocre player that was one of their leading RBI guys and doesn't replace him, they are supposed to score more runs...

donahue is a better coach than skinner, but he can only do so much with skinners crappy recruits, let alone skinners crappy recruits minus 2.

[talon]

Reading this board, I've been led to believe that Al Skinner was rock-bottom terrible. Anybody else would have been an improvement and Steve "Anybody Else" Donahue only loses Roche (who everybody agrees sucks) and Sanders (who everyone seems to believe is a clubhouse cancer and his departure is something to celebrate).
So, less than 15 wins next year would be a DISASTER.

Unless the loss of Roche/Sanders isn't a reason to be happy and/or unless Al Skinner was not a rock-bottom terrible coach.

Do you think Rakim was a good teammate?

now that's funny. You lose a starter (who never lived up to his hype/potential, but still scored 12 points a game) and don't replace him, and you are supposed to be a better team. Gotta love the skinner lovers. so if a really bad baseball team loses a mediocre player that was one of their leading RBI guys and doesn't replace him, they are supposed to score more runs...

donahue is a better coach than skinner, but he can only do so much with skinners crappy recruits, let alone skinners crappy recruits minus 2.

Now losing Rakim Sanders is a bad thing? Why were people happy about his departure?

[BC923]

Reading this board, I've been led to believe that Al Skinner was rock-bottom terrible. Anybody else would have been an improvement and Steve "Anybody Else" Donahue only loses Roche (who everybody agrees sucks) and Sanders (who everyone seems to believe is a clubhouse cancer and his departure is something to celebrate).
So, less than 15 wins next year would be a DISASTER.

Unless the loss of Roche/Sanders isn't a reason to be happy and/or unless Al Skinner was not a rock-bottom terrible coach.

Do you think Rakim was a good teammate?

now that's funny. You lose a starter (who never lived up to his hype/potential, but still scored 12 points a game) and don't replace him, and you are supposed to be a better team. Gotta love the skinner lovers. so if a really bad baseball team loses a mediocre player that was one of their leading RBI guys and doesn't replace him, they are supposed to score more runs...

donahue is a better coach than skinner, but he can only do so much with skinners crappy recruits, let alone skinners crappy recruits minus 2.

Now losing Rakim Sanders is a bad thing? Why were people happy about his departure?

Because it was almost painful to watch such a hyped player out of high school be so mediocre. Just a question, would you have preferred to stick with Skinner? If so, why?

[Eagledom]

Reading this board, I've been led to believe that Al Skinner was rock-bottom terrible. Anybody else would have been an improvement and Steve "Anybody Else" Donahue only loses Roche (who everybody agrees sucks) and Sanders (who everyone seems to believe is a clubhouse cancer and his departure is something to celebrate).
So, less than 15 wins next year would be a DISASTER.

Unless the loss of Roche/Sanders isn't a reason to be happy and/or unless Al Skinner was not a rock-bottom terrible coach.

Do you think Rakim was a good teammate?

now that's funny. You lose a starter (who never lived up to his hype/potential, but still scored 12 points a game) and don't replace him, and you are supposed to be a better team. Gotta love the skinner lovers. so if a really bad baseball team loses a mediocre player that was one of their leading RBI guys and doesn't replace him, they are supposed to score more runs...

donahue is a better coach than skinner, but he can only do so much with skinners crappy recruits, let alone skinners crappy recruits minus 2.

Now losing Rakim Sanders is a bad thing? Why were people happy about his departure?

Because it was almost painful to watch such a hyped player out of high school be so mediocre. Just a question, would you have preferred to stick with Skinner? If so, why?

please stop quoting this woman. Shee once claimed skinner was better than Coach K.

[talon]

Just a question, would you have preferred to stick with Skinner? If so, why?

I would have given Skinner one more year and let him know that he was on the hot seat.

[BC923]

Just a question, would you have preferred to stick with Skinner? If so, why?

I would have given Skinner one more year and let him know that he was on the hot seat.

maybe but having essentially a lame duck coach in a year with 6 open scholarships is very dangerous.

[HJS]

Reading this board, I've been led to believe that Al Skinner was rock-bottom terrible. Anybody else would have been an improvement and Steve "Anybody Else" Donahue only loses Roche (who everybody agrees sucks) and Sanders (who everyone seems to believe is a clubhouse cancer and his departure is something to celebrate).
So, less than 15 wins next year would be a DISASTER.

Unless the loss of Roche/Sanders isn't a reason to be happy and/or unless Al Skinner was not a rock-bottom terrible coach.

Do you think Rakim was a good teammate?

now that's funny. You lose a starter (who never lived up to his hype/potential, but still scored 12 points a game) and don't replace him, and you are supposed to be a better team. Gotta love the skinner lovers. so if a really bad baseball team loses a mediocre player that was one of their leading RBI guys and doesn't replace him, they are supposed to score more runs...

donahue is a better coach than skinner, but he can only do so much with skinners crappy recruits, let alone skinners crappy recruits minus 2.

Now losing Rakim Sanders is a bad thing? Why were people happy about his departure?

Because it was almost painful to watch such a hyped player out of high school be so mediocre.

Huh? Why does his hype outta of high school factor into this discussion? If he was a horribly thought-of prospect out of HS who we stole from Bryant but went on to average 12 a game, are we all really disappointed about his transfer???

I will say that I have heard that Sanders was a malcontent in the locker room and constant source of dissension amongst the coaches. I can understand any coach (new or old) willing to facilitate his departure. But, that is a move a coach makes to make his entire team better. So, losing Rakim should be means to get more wins.

Finally, OJ, the "and not replacing him" equation of losing Rakim is all up to Coach D. His effing job is to replace the players/recruits he is losing and/or forcing out. Literally, anyone can come into a program and blow it up. But, coaches are paid the big bucks to QUICKLY rebuild it better than it was.

[talon]

I just want to understand some things from people who think 15 wins next year would be a good season. which one of these three statements is incorrect:

Rakim Sanders = addition by subtraction

anybody else > Al Skinner

Steve Donahue > anybody else

[BCEagles25]

Al Skinner did a terrible job coaching with the talent he had last season. That is the only fact.

[Eagledom]

Reading this board, I've been led to believe that Al Skinner was rock-bottom terrible. Anybody else would have been an improvement and Steve "Anybody Else" Donahue only loses Roche (who everybody agrees sucks) and Sanders (who everyone seems to believe is a clubhouse cancer and his departure is something to celebrate).
So, less than 15 wins next year would be a DISASTER.

Unless the loss of Roche/Sanders isn't a reason to be happy and/or unless Al Skinner was not a rock-bottom terrible coach.

Do you think Rakim was a good teammate?

now that's funny. You lose a starter (who never lived up to his hype/potential, but still scored 12 points a game) and don't replace him, and you are supposed to be a better team. Gotta love the skinner lovers. so if a really bad baseball team loses a mediocre player that was one of their leading RBI guys and doesn't replace him, they are supposed to score more runs...

donahue is a better coach than skinner, but he can only do so much with skinners crappy recruits, let alone skinners crappy recruits minus 2.

Now losing Rakim Sanders is a bad thing? Why were people happy about his departure?

Because it was almost painful to watch such a hyped player out of high school be so mediocre.

Huh? Why does his hype outta of high school factor into this discussion? If he was a horribly thought-of prospect out of HS who we stole from Bryant but went on to average 12 a game, are we all really disappointed about his transfer???

I will say that I have heard that Sanders was a malcontent in the locker room and constant source of dissension amongst the coaches. I can understand any coach (new or old) willing to facilitate his departure. But, that is a move a coach makes to make his entire team better. So, losing Rakim should be means to get more wins.

Finally, OJ, the "and not replacing him" equation of losing Rakim is all up to Coach D. His effing job is to replace the players/recruits he is losing and/or forcing out. Literally, anyone can come into a program and blow it up. But, coaches are paid the big bucks to QUICKLY rebuild it better than it was.

you are an idiot. He will rebuild and replace guys like sanders - crap recruits from skinner. But its hard to ask to replace players for THIS year when you take over in April, when most players have signed already. He will start building with the 2011 class. Fucking moron.

[talon]

you are an idiot. He will rebuild and replace guys like sanders - crap recruits from skinner. But its hard to ask to replace players for THIS year when you take over in April, when most players have signed already. He will start building with the 2011 class. Fucking moron.

in other words, Steve Donahue is a significantly better coach than Al Skinner, but since he's without Rakim Sanders and Tyler Roche this year, we'll take a step back in 2010/11.

[BC923]

3 more posts to ?

[talon]

Al Skinner did a terrible job coaching with the talent he had last season. That is the only fact.

So, with a much better coach and pretty much the exact same team next year, how many wins will Donahue deliver? I'm just trying to wrap my head around the notion that 15 wins might be a great coaching job. Is Rakim Sanders that big of a loss now?

[BC923]

Al Skinner did a terrible job coaching with the talent he had last season. That is the only fact.

So, with a much better coach and pretty much the exact same team next year, how many wins will Donahue deliver? I'm just trying to wrap my head around the notion that 15 wins might be a great coaching job. Is Rakim Sanders that big of a loss now?

I believe Donahue is a better coach, and I believe getting rid of Sanders (only him) was a good idea, but one that might not help the team wins wise (it's not going to raise the win total), but more so chemistry wise. This team could probably win 16/17 with Sanders and I don't think they lose much if anything off that number without him. Yes, I believe coaching this team to 16 wins is a good coaching job, 18 or 19 might be a great one. This just isn't really an ACC caliber team right now, but I think as Donahue brings in better kids that suit his style we will improve and the standards for wins will go up.

[BCEagle74]

Al Skinner did a terrible job coaching with the talent he had last season. That is the only fact.

WINNER!

[BCEagles25]

Al Skinner did a terrible job coaching with the talent he had last season. That is the only fact.

So, with a much better coach and pretty much the exact same team next year, how many wins will Donahue deliver? I'm just trying to wrap my head around the notion that 15 wins might be a great coaching job. Is Rakim Sanders that big of a loss now?

I dunno. I don't fuckin' know. That's why I gave you a simple statement and said "that's the only fact."

[BC923]

Al Skinner did a terrible job coaching with the talent he had last season. That is the only fact.

WINNER!

Not at all an Al defender but he didn't have that much talent last year. However, he still did a shit job coaching them, if he was able to beat Clemson he should be able to beat Maine. Al's teams are horribly inconsistent and that is one of the worst (of many) bad qualities that Al has as a coach.

[Eagledom]

Al Skinner did a terrible job coaching with the talent he had last season. That is the only fact.

So, with a much better coach and pretty much the exact same team next year, how many wins will Donahue deliver? I'm just trying to wrap my head around the notion that 15 wins might be a great coaching job. Is Rakim Sanders that big of a loss now?

I dunno. I don't fuckin' know. That's why I gave you a simple statement and said "that's the only fact."

stop quoting the "Al is the best we can do crowd"

[BCEagles25]

Al Skinner did a terrible job coaching with the talent he had last season. That is the only fact.

So, with a much better coach and pretty much the exact same team next year, how many wins will Donahue deliver? I'm just trying to wrap my head around the notion that 15 wins might be a great coaching job. Is Rakim Sanders that big of a loss now?

I dunno. I don't fuckin' know. That's why I gave you a simple statement and said "that's the only fact."

stop quoting the "Al is the best we can do crowd"

I'm not quoting anybody. You clearly don't understand the reason why I gave such a short and simple statement.