Here's the thing with Cooley/Coen

[HJS]

If this is who Gene knew he was going to hire (and he has admitted that "every good AD has his short list of replacements"), why not save $3mm... bring back Coen or Cooley or O'Shea THIS YEAR as Head Coach in Waiting? Tell Al he will be retiring in 2 years. If they are being saddled with Duquette and Murphy anyway, what's the big deal? It makes the transition seemless... it allows Skinner to save face... and it provides BC with endless amount of good press. Clumsily firing Skinner... paying a huge buyout... and then promoting a staffer... is Jags/Spaz all the eff over again.

[twballgame9]

It's not going to be Cooley or Coen. Donohue is the ahead of those guys I bet.

[Cadillac90]

If this is who Gene knew he was going to hire (and he has admitted that "every good AD has his short list of replacements"), why not save $3mm... bring back Coen or Cooley or O'Shea THIS YEAR as Head Coach in Waiting? Tell Al he will be retiring in 2 years. If they are being saddled with Duquette and Murphy anyway, what's the big deal? It makes the transition seemless... it allows Skinner to save face... and it provides BC with endless amount of good press. Clumsily firing Skinner... paying a huge buyout... and then promoting a staffer... is Jags/Spaz all the eff over again.

This would assume that DeFilippo were competent.

[BC '00]

As much as I think is not very bright and has a major inferiority complex, I don't think he's THAT stupid. That's why I think he's giving Coen/Cooley a chance to blow him away, but really just focused on trying to find an up-and-comer mid-major coach. Which is why it will probably be Donahue (or he's probably hoping for Stevens).

[Art Vandelay]

If this is who Gene knew he was going to hire (and he has admitted that "every good AD has his short list of replacements"), why not save $3mm... bring back Coen or Cooley or O'Shea THIS YEAR as Head Coach in Waiting? Tell Al he will be retiring in 2 years. If they are being saddled with Duquette and Murphy anyway, what's the big deal? It makes the transition seemless... it allows Skinner to save face... and it provides BC with endless amount of good press. Clumsily firing Skinner... paying a huge buyout... and then promoting a staffer... is Jags/Spaz all the eff over again.

Why would Coen or Cooley agree to come back and sit on Skinner's bench for 2 years?

[talon]

If this is who Gene knew he was going to hire (and he has admitted that "every good AD has his short list of replacements"), why not save $3mm... bring back Coen or Cooley or O'Shea THIS YEAR as Head Coach in Waiting? Tell Al he will be retiring in 2 years. If they are being saddled with Duquette and Murphy anyway, what's the big deal? It makes the transition seemless... it allows Skinner to save face... and it provides BC with endless amount of good press. Clumsily firing Skinner... paying a huge buyout... and then promoting a staffer... is Jags/Spaz all the eff over again.

Why would Coen or Cooley agree to come back and sit on Skinner's bench for 2 years?

a guaranteed coaching job in the ACC?

[Art Vandelay]

If this is who Gene knew he was going to hire (and he has admitted that "every good AD has his short list of replacements"), why not save $3mm... bring back Coen or Cooley or O'Shea THIS YEAR as Head Coach in Waiting? Tell Al he will be retiring in 2 years. If they are being saddled with Duquette and Murphy anyway, what's the big deal? It makes the transition seemless... it allows Skinner to save face... and it provides BC with endless amount of good press. Clumsily firing Skinner... paying a huge buyout... and then promoting a staffer... is Jags/Spaz all the eff over again.

Why would Coen or Cooley agree to come back and sit on Skinner's bench for 2 years?

a guaranteed coaching job in the ACC?

But why would they need to come back to do that? Couldn't Coen just keep coaching down the street and be told the BC job is his in 2 years?

[Byrdcall J]

If this is who Gene knew he was going to hire (and he has admitted that "every good AD has his short list of replacements"), why not save $3mm... bring back Coen or Cooley or O'Shea THIS YEAR as Head Coach in Waiting? Tell Al he will be retiring in 2 years. If they are being saddled with Duquette and Murphy anyway, what's the big deal? It makes the transition seemless... it allows Skinner to save face... and it provides BC with endless amount of good press. Clumsily firing Skinner... paying a huge buyout... and then promoting a staffer... is Jags/Spaz all the eff over again.

Why would Coen or Cooley agree to come back and sit on Skinner's bench for 2 years?

2 years isn't that long of a wait for a guarantee at the BC head coaching job, especially if Al was privately and quietly told he was a head coach in name only from this time onward. I don't think this would be a good situation though if it had played out that way in terms of the product on the court, however.

If there was ever a coach who wouldn't be completely insulted by a GDF power play like that it would be a humble guy like Skinner, but even this would be really pushing it.

[HJS]

If this is who Gene knew he was going to hire (and he has admitted that "every good AD has his short list of replacements"), why not save $3mm... bring back Coen or Cooley or O'Shea THIS YEAR as Head Coach in Waiting? Tell Al he will be retiring in 2 years. If they are being saddled with Duquette and Murphy anyway, what's the big deal? It makes the transition seemless... it allows Skinner to save face... and it provides BC with endless amount of good press. Clumsily firing Skinner... paying a huge buyout... and then promoting a staffer... is Jags/Spaz all the eff over again.

Why would Coen or Cooley agree to come back and sit on Skinner's bench for 2 years?

a guaranteed coaching job in the ACC?

Money. A huge effing buyout should BC go in a different direction. I mean really... do you think those guys are excited at the thought of retiring at Fairfield, Northeastern or Bryant? They are there PRAYING each and every day that someone from the Atlantic 10 notices their work and one day eventually make it to a major conference.

[Bryn Mawr Eagle]

But why would they need to come back to do that? Couldn't Coen just keep coaching down the street and be told the BC job is his in 2 years?

This. HJS, I think you're just way off here.

[Art Vandelay]

If this is who Gene knew he was going to hire (and he has admitted that "every good AD has his short list of replacements"), why not save $3mm... bring back Coen or Cooley or O'Shea THIS YEAR as Head Coach in Waiting? Tell Al he will be retiring in 2 years. If they are being saddled with Duquette and Murphy anyway, what's the big deal? It makes the transition seemless... it allows Skinner to save face... and it provides BC with endless amount of good press. Clumsily firing Skinner... paying a huge buyout... and then promoting a staffer... is Jags/Spaz all the eff over again.

Why would Coen or Cooley agree to come back and sit on Skinner's bench for 2 years?

a guaranteed coaching job in the ACC?

Money. A huge effing buyout should BC go in a different direction. I mean really... do you think those guys are excited at the thought of retiring at Fairfield, Northeastern or Bryant? They are there PRAYING each and every day that someone from the Atlantic 10 notices their work and one day eventually make it to a major conference.

My point is if GDF knew he wanted Coen and Coen knew he wanted to coach at BC, what benefit is there to haveing him as an assistant to Al for the next two years. If anything getting experience running his own team is more beneficial.

Plus if Al was lazy before how hard is he going to work the next two years knowing he is done? If you wanted to go that route where Al finishes his contract and you hire Coen, then just let Al keep doing what he's doing and keep Coen at NU with the understanding you intend to hire him.

That would of course mean throwing away the next few years to save $3M.

[Byrdcall J]

If this is who Gene knew he was going to hire (and he has admitted that "every good AD has his short list of replacements"), why not save $3mm... bring back Coen or Cooley or O'Shea THIS YEAR as Head Coach in Waiting? Tell Al he will be retiring in 2 years. If they are being saddled with Duquette and Murphy anyway, what's the big deal? It makes the transition seemless... it allows Skinner to save face... and it provides BC with endless amount of good press. Clumsily firing Skinner... paying a huge buyout... and then promoting a staffer... is Jags/Spaz all the eff over again.

Why would Coen or Cooley agree to come back and sit on Skinner's bench for 2 years?

a guaranteed coaching job in the ACC?

But why would they need to come back to do that? Couldn't Coen just keep coaching down the street and be told the BC job is his in 2 years?

HJS' point is that they really would have been inheriting a much more stable situation if they came back and quietly assumed power while Al was put out to pasture. Obviously Gene has a lot more incentive to blow the whole Skinner coaching tree up now that this whole thing is public. Also, he's right. GDF will either look cheap or shortsighted if he just hires a former Skinner assistant while unceremoniously dumping the program's wins leader.

[HJS]

I don't think this would be a good situation though if it had played out that way in terms of the product on the court, however.

If there was ever a coach who wouldn't be completely insulted by a GDF power play like that it would be a humble guy like Skinner, but even this would be really pushing it.

I totally disagree. BC would be bringing back one of HIS guys. I ain't talking about bringing Donahue in to do that... yes, that would've been a mess. Coen/Cooley would just come back and do what they did for all those years before they left... run practice and recruit. They would be running every aspect of the program except not-calling timeouts and in-bound plays. THIS is the way you gently push out a longtime coach.

[eepstein0]

Here's my comment:

Do not bring back anything having to do with Al Skinner. This means no Cooley and no Coen.

[Logitano]

Didn't Al think based on last year's results he merited an extension? Al also was given the opportunity to keep his job by shaking up his staff and he said no.

[Byrdcall J]

I don't think this would be a good situation though if it had played out that way in terms of the product on the court, however.

If there was ever a coach who wouldn't be completely insulted by a GDF power play like that it would be a humble guy like Skinner, but even this would be really pushing it.

I totally disagree. BC would be bringing back one of HIS guys. I ain't talking about bringing Donahue in to do that... yes, that would've been a mess. Coen/Cooley would just come back and do what they did for all those years before they left... run practice and recruit. They would be running every aspect of the program except not-calling timeouts and in-bound plays. THIS is the way you gently push out a longtime coach.

Not sure where we are in disagreement. When I said I didn't think it would be a good situation, I'm just speculating that if Gene's main reason for letting Al go was the excitement surrounding the program, I wouldn't expect either Coen or Cooley returning as an "assistant" with quiet control of the program to be able to change that paradigm surrounding the program right away (with regards to ticket sales or "selling the program")

Wins and losses on the other hand...

[BC '00]

I don't think this would be a good situation though if it had played out that way in terms of the product on the court, however.

If there was ever a coach who wouldn't be completely insulted by a GDF power play like that it would be a humble guy like Skinner, but even this would be really pushing it.

I totally disagree. BC would be bringing back one of HIS guys. I ain't talking about bringing Donahue in to do that... yes, that would've been a mess. Coen/Cooley would just come back and do what they did for all those years before they left... run practice and recruit. They would be running every aspect of the program except not-calling timeouts and in-bound plays. THIS is the way you gently push out a longtime coach.

Would a coach who thinks they deserve a HC job agree to come back to BC as an assistant after running their own program for a while? Even as HC-in-waiting? Jimbo Fisher didn't leave a head-coaching spot to get that title.

[HJS]

Not sure where we are in disagreement. When I said I didn't think it would be a good situation, I'm just speculating that if Gene's main reason for letting Al go was the excitement surrounding the program, I wouldn't expect either Coen or Cooley returning as an "assistant" with quiet control of the program to be able to change that paradigm surrounding the program right away (with regards to ticket sales or "selling the program")

Wins and losses on the other hand...

Excitement won't be created if either is hired as the head coach either. I am saying if GDF is determined to go down this road, it would have been a better play to do the coach-in-waiting thing. That route, btw, would also help with recruits who would see the clear succession of power. Isn't this exactly what is playing out in Cuse?

[Byrdcall J]

I don't think this would be a good situation though if it had played out that way in terms of the product on the court, however.

If there was ever a coach who wouldn't be completely insulted by a GDF power play like that it would be a humble guy like Skinner, but even this would be really pushing it.

I totally disagree. BC would be bringing back one of HIS guys. I ain't talking about bringing Donahue in to do that... yes, that would've been a mess. Coen/Cooley would just come back and do what they did for all those years before they left... run practice and recruit. They would be running every aspect of the program except not-calling timeouts and in-bound plays. THIS is the way you gently push out a longtime coach.

Would a coach who thinks they deserve a HC job agree to come back to BC as an assistant after running their own program for a while? Even as HC-in-waiting? Jimbo Fisher didn't leave a head-coaching spot to get that title.

I guess that's an ego thing that would depend on the individual coach. Not too many coaches get to make that jump from conferences like the MAAC to one of the Big 6, so it wouldn't be a terrible deal. McCaffery did it this year with the move to Iowa, but he's been a hot name for a while now. Cooley and Coen probably have some more work to do at that level before getting real looks from the Big 6.

[Byrdcall J]

Not sure where we are in disagreement. When I said I didn't think it would be a good situation, I'm just speculating that if Gene's main reason for letting Al go was the excitement surrounding the program, I wouldn't expect either Coen or Cooley returning as an "assistant" with quiet control of the program to be able to change that paradigm surrounding the program right away (with regards to ticket sales or "selling the program")

Wins and losses on the other hand...

Excitement won't be created if either is hired as the head coach either. I am saying if GDF is determined to go down this road, it would have been a better play to do the coach-in-waiting thing. That route, btw, would also help with recruits who would see the clear succession of power. Isn't this exactly what is playing out in Cuse?

Yeah, I mean I am totally in agreement with you. You misquoted BC '00 here so maybe you were responding to him initially. I think you are right on on this one.

[HJS]

Would a coach who thinks they deserve a HC job agree to come back to BC as an assistant after running their own program for a while? Even as HC-in-waiting? Jimbo Fisher didn't leave a head-coaching spot to get that title.

Absofuckinglutely. Fairfield and Northeastern are another coaching move away from being eligible for a Big 6 conference job. Just watch how long it will take either of those guys to land another big job should they miss out on BC. And, the Jimbo Fisher analogy is stupid because there aren't enough micro-majors playing football. But, if he was the head coach at Citadel... yes... he would leave that post for a chance to be coach-in-waiting at FSU.

[ATLeagle]

Would a coach who thinks they deserve a HC job agree to come back to BC as an assistant after running their own program for a while? Even as HC-in-waiting? Jimbo Fisher didn't leave a head-coaching spot to get that title.

Absofuckinglutely. Fairfield and Northeastern are another coaching move away from being eligible for a Big 6 conference job. Just watch how long it will take either of those guys to land another big job should they miss out on BC. And, the Jimbo Fisher analogy is stupid because there aren't enough micro-majors playing football. But, if he was the head coach at Citadel... yes... he would leave that post for a chance to be coach-in-waiting at FSU.

I disagree with Fairfield and Northeastern being two stops away from BC. McCaffery went from Siena to Iowa. The drunk went from Northeastern to UConn.

There is something to be said for promoting guys from the region. Wisconsin has a track record of doing it. Southern Illinois to Illinois was a big jump for Weber. I could go on.

[HJS]

I disagree with Fairfield and Northeastern being two stops away from BC. McCaffery went from Siena to Iowa. The drunk went from Northeastern to UConn.

There is something to be said for promoting guys from the region. Wisconsin has a track record of doing it. Southern Illinois to Illinois was a big jump for Weber. I could go on.

Siena has some track record with Hewitt going to GT. But, both McCaffrey and Hewitt were hot names for quite some time before they were able to make their move. The UConn hire isn't really relevant to today's world. UConn was dogcrap and Northeastern was winning freaking big with Reggie Lewis. Yes... if Coen or Cooley land the next Reggie Lewis and ride him to 100 wins and 4 consecutive NCAA appearances... yes... they could get a major gig. But, it is that kind of stars-alligning scenario that they face. At the same time, one bad year from either of them and they are set back another 3 years.

[Art Vandelay]

I disagree with Fairfield and Northeastern being two stops away from BC. McCaffery went from Siena to Iowa. The drunk went from Northeastern to UConn.

There is something to be said for promoting guys from the region. Wisconsin has a track record of doing it. Southern Illinois to Illinois was a big jump for Weber. I could go on.

Siena has some track record with Hewitt going to GT. But, both McCaffrey and Hewitt were hot names for quite some time before they were able to make their move. The UConn hire isn't really relevant to today's world. UConn was dogcrap and Northeastern was winning freaking big with Reggie Lewis. Yes... if Coen or Cooley land the next Reggie Lewis and ride him to 100 wins and 4 consecutive NCAA appearances... yes... they could get a major gig. But, it is that kind of stars-alligning scenario that they face. At the same time, one bad year from either of them and they are set back another 3 years.

What conferences do you put on the same level as the CAA and MAAC? Just curious becuase there are a lot of those one bid conferences out there there that major conference coaches have come from.

Using those conferences as an example Jeff Capel just went from VCU to Oklahoma recently. As I recall Tim Welsh went from Iona to Providence directly. Fairfield and NU are not two steps from a major conference job. As stated when talking about guys going from an assitant coach to a major conference, a lot of it has to do with the number of jobs. in the 5 big conferences (ACC, BE, B12, B11 and Pac 10) there are 61 schools. Of those a solid number are guys that are not going anywhere, so there just aren't that many openings. This year there have been a lot more than usual and we are still talking about what 6 jobs.

Bottom line is this is a stupid idea becuase there is no reason Coen would need to come back as an assistant for two years in order to be the heir to the job.

[Byrdcall J]

Bottom line is this is a stupid idea becuase there is no reason Coen would need to come back as an assistant for two years in order to be the heir to the job.

Art, I respect your opinion but I think you are getting caught up in the prestige of the coaching jobs in question and not seeing HJS' original point in terms of logistics and PR.

Coen and Cooley will be forever linked to Al Skinner. GDF has publicly gone on record as saying he wants to shake things up with this hiring and change the culture that was surrounding the program. Wouldn't you say that he has less incentive to hire them based on their association with the coach he just fired? I don't think it has anything to do with the fact that they coach at Northeastern and Fairfield, it was just a hypothetical explanation that if GDF knew he wanted one of them to take over the program, he could have asked them to come back and quietly assume control with a guarantee that they'd be named head coach and receive their payday at the end of Skinner's contract.

Now they have to worry about competing with Steve Donahue et. al and Gene's comments that he wanted to part with Skinner and his philosophy. I don't think it has anything to do with the CAA or the MAAC.

[Art Vandelay]

Bottom line is this is a stupid idea becuase there is no reason Coen would need to come back as an assistant for two years in order to be the heir to the job.

Art, I respect your opinion but I think you are getting caught up in the prestige of the coaching jobs in question and not seeing HJS' original point in terms of logistics and PR.

Coen and Cooley will be forever linked to Al Skinner. GDF has publicly gone on record as saying he wants to shake things up with this hiring and change the culture that was surrounding the program. Wouldn't you say that he has less incentive to hire them based on their association with the coach he just fired? I don't think it has anything to do with the fact that they coach at Northeastern and Fairfield, it was just a hypothetical explanation that if GDF knew he wanted them to take over the program, he could have asked them to come back and quietly assume control with a guarantee that they'd be named head coach and receive their payday at the end of Skinner's contract.

Now they have to worry about competing with Steve Donahue et. al and Gene's comments that he wanted to part with Skinner and his philosophy.

No I get his point...I just think it's stupid. I don't think Coen or Cooley should get the job. If in the scenario laid out, GDF decided he wanted one of them and was going let Al finish his contract, there is no good reason they need to be here as an assitant for two years for that to happen. That is my main point.

HJS made the silly comment that Fairfield and NU are two steps from BC, which is also a stupid statement refuted by facts, but never let those get in the way.

[eepstein0]

Would a coach who thinks they deserve a HC job agree to come back to BC as an assistant after running their own program for a while? Even as HC-in-waiting? Jimbo Fisher didn't leave a head-coaching spot to get that title.

Absofuckinglutely. Fairfield and Northeastern are another coaching move away from being eligible for a Big 6 conference job. Just watch how long it will take either of those guys to land another big job should they miss out on BC. And, the Jimbo Fisher analogy is stupid because there aren't enough micro-majors playing football. But, if he was the head coach at Citadel... yes... he would leave that post for a chance to be coach-in-waiting at FSU.

I disagree with Fairfield and Northeastern being two stops away from BC. McCaffery went from Siena to Iowa. The drunk went from Northeastern to UConn.

There is something to be said for promoting guys from the region. Wisconsin has a track record of doing it. Southern Illinois to Illinois was a big jump for Weber. I could go on.

UConn wasn't UConn when the drunk made that move. Iowa isn't exactly a basketball hotbed either.

[HJS]

No I get his point...I just think it's stupid. I don't think Coen or Cooley should get the job. If in the scenario laid out, GDF decided he wanted one of them and was going let Al finish his contract, there is no good reason they need to be here as an assitant for two years for that to happen. That is my main point.

HJS made the silly comment that Fairfield and NU are two steps from BC, which is also a stupid statement refuted by facts, but never let those get in the way.

The "good reason" is so that they have familiarity with the program, players and a say in recruiting. Essentially, we would be looking for the same benefits that we supposedly have by handing Spaz the gig in FB.

As for Fairfield... here are their coaches:
1948-1949 Joe Dunn
1949-1950 Bob Noonan
1950-1958 James Hanrahan
1958-1968 George Bisacca
1968-1970 Jim Lynam
1970-1981 Fred Barakat
1981-1985 Terry O'Conner
1985-1991 Mitch Buonoguoro
1991-1998 Paul Cormier
1998-2006 Tim O'Toole
2006-Present Ed Cooley

As for Northeaster... here are their coaches:
1920-1921 Charles Foster
1921-1923 Madison Jeffrey
1923-1929 Rufus Bond
1929-1937 Al McCoy
1937-1942 Jim Dunn
1942-1945 Foxy Flumere
1945-1946 Eugene Pare
1946-1948 William Grinnell
1948-1958 Joe Zabilski
1958-1971 Dick Dukeshire
1971-1972 Jim Bowman
1972-1986 Jim Calhoun
1986-1994 Karl Fogel
1994-1996 Dave Leitao
1996-2001 Rudy Keeling
2001-2006 Ron Everhart
2006-Present Bill Coen

That is a list of 28 coaching names. How many moved directly to a major conference (besides Calhoun who rode Reggie Lewis to a horrible UConn program in the fledgling Big East)?

[BC '00]

1972-1986 Jim Calhoun

That is a list of 28 coaching names. How many moved directly to a major conference (besides Calhoun who rode Reggie Lewis to a horrible UConn program in the fledgling Big East)?

You have some valid points but tend to overstate your case. For example: "fledgling Big East." Agreed that UConn was horrible, but the Big East had been operating since I believe 81 (maybe 79?) and had just sent 3 teams to the Final Four. That's not exactly a "fledgling" conference in my book. Still young, but pretty damn well-established.

[Endless Mike]

1998-2006 Tim O'Toole

I'm glad Timmy finally got out of that well.