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Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:09 pm
by Los
I came here to watch this board explode. :popcorn

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:23 pm
by HJS
Not enough people care for anything to explode.

That said, I’m glad Marty is continuing the spirit of social distancing by quarantining the basketball program from any fans for another year.

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:03 pm
by eepstein0
HJS wrote:Not enough people care for anything to explode.

That said, I’m glad Marty is continuing the spirit of social distancing by quarantining the basketball program from any fans for another year.


I’m probably the most diehard on the board (I still went to about every home game) and I just don’t care at this point.

The Langford deal makes me really nervous next year

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:11 pm
by sparky
I've suddenly gone from thinking that players should be paid to fans should be paid.

How can anybody who is into this team NOT consider just checking out of following this team for a while.

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Mon Mar 23, 2020 7:16 pm
by Bryn Mawr Eagle
Ho Lee Fuk

I really thought Christian was done.

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Mon Mar 23, 2020 8:05 pm
by Corporal Funishment
Looking forward to another year of exciting basketball!

Steff Mitchell (PBUH) for All America!

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Mon Mar 23, 2020 10:52 pm
by innocentbystander
eepstein0 wrote:
claver2010 wrote:i wonder how much the impending recession + possibility of no college football season (hence limited tv $$) had on this

thamel wrote an article on this today

@julianbenbow
Boston College will keep head coach Jim Christian. BC finished with a losing record for the fifth time in Christian's six seasons. AD Martin Jarmond said, “There is so much uncertainty right now with everything. You need to be steady and you need to have calm in uncertain times.”

@julianbenbow
Jarmond and Christian met face-to-face this morning. (They stayed six feet apart and used hand sanitizer when they left).

@julianbenbow
They both expressed their outlook on the program. Jarmond gave his evaluation and expectations. Christian laid out the ways he felt the program could be better supported.


I get it, but this is very disappointing.


Jarmond didn't give him a contract extension did he?

I guess (now) tre will be depriving us of his presence for at least a year.

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Tue Mar 24, 2020 1:05 pm
by Bunratty
eepstein0 wrote:
HJS wrote:Not enough people care for anything to explode.

That said, I’m glad Marty is continuing the spirit of social distancing by quarantining the basketball program from any fans for another year.


I’m probably the most diehard on the board (I still went to about every home game) and I just don’t care at this point.

The Langford deal makes me really nervous next year

What do you mean by "the Langford deal?"

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Tue Mar 24, 2020 3:35 pm
by BC923
No P5 schools are making changes because they’re worried about lower revenues next year.

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Tue Mar 24, 2020 4:46 pm
by MilitantEagle
BC923 wrote:No P5 schools are making changes because they’re worried about lower revenues next year.


Yup. His retention is completely understandable under the circumstances.

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Tue Mar 24, 2020 5:29 pm
by eepstein0
MilitantEagle wrote:
BC923 wrote:No P5 schools are making changes because they’re worried about lower revenues next year.


Yup. His retention is completely understandable under the circumstances.


Completely disagree. He should’ve been fired after they lost to Pitt in the ACCT last year by about 30

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Tue Mar 24, 2020 5:46 pm
by MilitantEagle
eepstein0 wrote:
MilitantEagle wrote:
BC923 wrote:No P5 schools are making changes because they’re worried about lower revenues next year.


Yup. His retention is completely understandable under the circumstances.


Completely disagree. He should’ve been fired after they lost to Pitt in the ACCT last year by about 30


Not talking about last year. I am talking about the circumstances on March 23, 2020 when the decision to keep him was announced. For all we know, BC will have reduced revenues in 20-21 because of the virus. It's a tough spot.

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Tue Mar 24, 2020 7:41 pm
by TobaccoRoadEagle
MilitantEagle wrote:
eepstein0 wrote:
MilitantEagle wrote:
BC923 wrote:No P5 schools are making changes because they’re worried about lower revenues next year.


Yup. His retention is completely understandable under the circumstances.


Completely disagree. He should’ve been fired after they lost to Pitt in the ACCT last year by about 30


Not talking about last year. I am talking about the circumstances on March 23, 2020 when the decision to keep him was announced. For all we know, BC will have reduced revenues in 20-21 because of the virus. It's a tough spot.

so instead they GUARANTEE they have reduced revenue by keeping the losingest coach in the conference? that doesn't seem like a sound decision either

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Tue Mar 24, 2020 9:03 pm
by MilitantEagle
TobaccoRoadEagle wrote:
MilitantEagle wrote:
eepstein0 wrote:
MilitantEagle wrote:
BC923 wrote:No P5 schools are making changes because they’re worried about lower revenues next year.


Yup. His retention is completely understandable under the circumstances.


Completely disagree. He should’ve been fired after they lost to Pitt in the ACCT last year by about 30


Not talking about last year. I am talking about the circumstances on March 23, 2020 when the decision to keep him was announced. For all we know, BC will have reduced revenues in 20-21 because of the virus. It's a tough spot.

so instead they GUARANTEE they have reduced revenue by keeping the losingest coach in the conference? that doesn't seem like a sound decision either


Since you are an accountant, you could probably tell me more about the challenges with the upcoming budget and committing a large sum of money to a new coach when revenues are uncertain. One can't even assume the football season, the main source of revenues, is guaranteed at this point.

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Tue Mar 24, 2020 10:31 pm
by Dick Rosenthal
Well, at least I can ignore basketball for another year. Cowardly move by Marty. And spare me the uncertain budget bullshit. Even with the Chinese Virus Economic Implosion BC is still sitting on 3 billion (instead of 3.5 billion). Even if next season was going to be cancelled—which it will not—they still should have shit canned Jimmy MAC as a matter of principle.

We are such a second rate, small-timey athletic program burdened by cowardly leadership from the top down. I guess Marty is fine with this fiasco. They should just play the games in Power Gym and save the trouble of keeping the lights on in Conte. That will save them some money in uncertain times as well.

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Tue Mar 24, 2020 11:02 pm
by MilitantEagle
Dick Rosenthal wrote:Well, at least I can ignore basketball for another year. Cowardly move by Marty. And spare me the uncertain budget bullshit. Even with the Chinese Virus Economic Implosion BC is still sitting on 3 billion (instead of 3.5 billion). Even if next season was going to be cancelled—which it will not—they still should have shit canned Jimmy MAC as a matter of principle.

We are such a second rate, small-timey athletic program burdened by cowardly leadership from the top down. I guess Marty is fine with this fiasco. They should just play the games in Power Gym and save the trouble of keeping the lights on in Conte. That will save them some money in uncertain times as well.


They can't use the endowment money for whatever they want.

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2020 7:17 am
by Dick Rosenthal
Correct. They can’t do massive capital projects like closing in the stadium corners, but they certainly can utilize it to make up for a budget shortfall for an underfunded department—and yes, that includes athletics.

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2020 8:33 am
by HJS
Dick Rosenthal wrote:We are such a second rate, small-timey athletic program burdened by cowardly leadership from the top down. I guess Marty is fine with this fiasco. They should just play the games in Power Gym and save the trouble of keeping the lights on in Conte. That will save them some money in uncertain times as well.

It's really this (including the suggestion of playing Power Gym)

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2020 8:58 am
by TobaccoRoadEagle
MilitantEagle wrote:
Dick Rosenthal wrote:Well, at least I can ignore basketball for another year. Cowardly move by Marty. And spare me the uncertain budget bullshit. Even with the Chinese Virus Economic Implosion BC is still sitting on 3 billion (instead of 3.5 billion). Even if next season was going to be cancelled—which it will not—they still should have shit canned Jimmy MAC as a matter of principle.

We are such a second rate, small-timey athletic program burdened by cowardly leadership from the top down. I guess Marty is fine with this fiasco. They should just play the games in Power Gym and save the trouble of keeping the lights on in Conte. That will save them some money in uncertain times as well.


They can't use the endowment money for whatever they want.

i wish more people shared this fact back when we had a mysterious stranger building all sorts of lego models of things that could never possibly happen and complaining the bc wasn't spending restricted endowment money it was not allowed to spend.

that said, the earnings from the $3 billion that can be spent on shit like a new basketball coach would be available to spend on shit like a new basketball coach

kinda like angry dick said in his retort above

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2020 1:22 pm
by claver2010
shaka is staying put at texas

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Sat Apr 11, 2020 8:31 am
by Dick Rosenthal
Not sure if anyone reads the Three Man Weave blog. It is a hit or miss proposition—they have some really good analytical stuff from time to time and some really dumb opinion pieces from time to time. Anyway, they did a ranking of every D1 Coach based on a variety of factors including expectations vs performance, program norms over a 50 year period, etc. They utilize Kenpom and other rankings in the mix to set criteria. Not sure what I think of it, but without comment, Jimmy MAC comes in at 221 ahead of Danny Manning at 248, but behind Josh Pastner at 219. Our previous coach, Beeker, came in at 198 despite recent success at Penn and historical success well beyond the norm at Cornell.

Some other names that have been mentioned on various wish lists here or programs of interest include Tommy Amaker (165), Mike Hopkins (135), Bill Coen (130), King Rice (114), Ed Cooley (88), John Becker (77), Will Brown (76), Shaka Smart (74), Mark Schmidt (72), Bobby Hurley (63), Danny Hurley (55), Bob McKillop (38), Jim Boeheim (37), Bruce Pearl (16), Roy Williams (8), Jay Wright (7), Coach K (6), Tony Bennett (1).

They acknowledge the problem with Roy Williams being ranked that high—they had him at 153 on a pure performance metric and a seasonal expectations ranking, but the multiple National Championships in a relatively concentrated period of time vs the historical reality that Dean Smith is biggest underachiever in coaching history buoyed his ranking substantially.

Williams aside, I’d have had Jay Wright at 1, but Bennett isn’t that controversial. I’d have McKillop significantly higher, but a lot of these guys fall in a range where I’d have them. There seem to be more wild misses in the Top 20 that the rest of the rankings.

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2020 12:16 pm
by HJS
Did the coronavirus completely miss North Carolina? I ask because Wake Forest did what we weren’t able.
https://www.espn.com/mens-college-baske ... ny-manning

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2020 12:32 pm
by claver2010
and it cost a smaller school more for him to go away

mj has completely fucked up decisions around the basketball program over the last 14 months

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2020 1:43 pm
by Corporal Funishment
Manning was getting paid more than JC and his teams the last couple of years were worse. At Wake, recruiting was trending downward and players transferring out were much better than those coming in, in contrast to BC where the opposite is closer to the truth.

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2020 4:49 pm
by eepstein0
Corporal Funishment wrote:Manning was getting paid more than JC and his teams the last couple of years were worse. At Wake, recruiting was trending downward and players transferring out were much better than those coming in, in contrast to BC where the opposite is closer to the truth.


Manning’s buyout was also ridiculously high. They’re both terrible you’re splitting hairs between Manning and JC

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Sat Apr 25, 2020 5:25 pm
by HJS
claver2010 wrote:and it cost a smaller school more for him to go away

mj has completely fucked up decisions around the basketball program over the last 14 months

Very soon after being hired, Marty made the decision to move on from Daz as quickly as possible. He also decided that he really liked JC and (with proper support) thought he could be the long term answer. Let’s not forget, Jarmond gave Jimmy Mac a very real extension thinking that we turned the corner by getting an NIT invite. That, more than anything, has been the mistake that Marty has had to live with. Corona gave him an easy excuse.

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Sun Apr 26, 2020 10:40 am
by MilitantEagle
HJS wrote:
claver2010 wrote:and it cost a smaller school more for him to go away

mj has completely fucked up decisions around the basketball program over the last 14 months

Very soon after being hired, Marty made the decision to move on from Daz as quickly as possible. He also decided that he really liked JC and (with proper support) thought he could be the long term answer. Let’s not forget, Jarmond gave Jimmy Mac a very real extension thinking that we turned the corner by getting an NIT invite. That, more than anything, has been the mistake that Marty has had to live with. Corona gave him an easy excuse.


We don't entirely know what is going on behind the scenes. Supposedly, BC had feelers out for Beilein and he had no interest. I'm sure Jarmond had some top targets and perhaps they said no way. The next hire may be the most important hire in the program's history and it needs to be as close as possible to a slam dunk hire. No point in blowing it up again for another MAC level coach or some random assistant.

Also, the trend for the basketball program both in recruiting and results, while ever so slight and a little bumpy, has been mostly upward. 6 wins in the first three years and 19 in the last three (with two extra games). Certainly not amazing and I'm not defending MJ's decision or JC, just saying that you can see the rationale if certain assumptions are being made.

ACC record
4-14
0-18
2-16
7-11
5-13
7-13

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Sun Apr 26, 2020 1:21 pm
by thebs19
MilitantEagle wrote:
HJS wrote:
claver2010 wrote:and it cost a smaller school more for him to go away

mj has completely fucked up decisions around the basketball program over the last 14 months

Very soon after being hired, Marty made the decision to move on from Daz as quickly as possible. He also decided that he really liked JC and (with proper support) thought he could be the long term answer. Let’s not forget, Jarmond gave Jimmy Mac a very real extension thinking that we turned the corner by getting an NIT invite. That, more than anything, has been the mistake that Marty has had to live with. Corona gave him an easy excuse.


We don't entirely know what is going on behind the scenes. Supposedly, BC had feelers out for Beilein and he had no interest. I'm sure Jarmond had some top targets and perhaps they said no way. The next hire may be the most important hire in the program's history and it needs to be as close as possible to a slam dunk hire. No point in blowing it up again for another MAC level coach or some random assistant.

Also, the trend for the basketball program both in recruiting and results, while ever so slight and a little bumpy, has been mostly upward. 6 wins in the first three years and 19 in the last three (with two extra games). Certainly not amazing and I'm not defending MJ's decision or JC, just saying that you can see the rationale if certain assumptions are being made.

ACC record
4-14
0-18
2-16
7-11
5-13
7-13


This has very little to do with an improving BC, and more to do with the ACC coming down a level where bad teams can steal wins (versus 5 years ago or so). The only team in the list above that is really any different than the others is that 2017-2018 team, which with 2 NBA guards got all the way to a "top of the lower quarter of the ACC" finish.

This year's "7-13" is meaningless without context. This wasn't a better team than last years or even the 2-16 team from 2016-2017.

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Sun Apr 26, 2020 1:31 pm
by MilitantEagle
thebs19 wrote:
MilitantEagle wrote:
HJS wrote:
claver2010 wrote:and it cost a smaller school more for him to go away

mj has completely fucked up decisions around the basketball program over the last 14 months

Very soon after being hired, Marty made the decision to move on from Daz as quickly as possible. He also decided that he really liked JC and (with proper support) thought he could be the long term answer. Let’s not forget, Jarmond gave Jimmy Mac a very real extension thinking that we turned the corner by getting an NIT invite. That, more than anything, has been the mistake that Marty has had to live with. Corona gave him an easy excuse.


We don't entirely know what is going on behind the scenes. Supposedly, BC had feelers out for Beilein and he had no interest. I'm sure Jarmond had some top targets and perhaps they said no way. The next hire may be the most important hire in the program's history and it needs to be as close as possible to a slam dunk hire. No point in blowing it up again for another MAC level coach or some random assistant.

Also, the trend for the basketball program both in recruiting and results, while ever so slight and a little bumpy, has been mostly upward. 6 wins in the first three years and 19 in the last three (with two extra games). Certainly not amazing and I'm not defending MJ's decision or JC, just saying that you can see the rationale if certain assumptions are being made.

ACC record
4-14
0-18
2-16
7-11
5-13
7-13


This has very little to do with an improving BC, and more to do with the ACC coming down a level where bad teams can steal wins (versus 5 years ago or so). The only team in the list above that is really any different than the others is that 2017-2018 team, which with 2 NBA guards got all the way to a "top of the lower quarter of the ACC" finish.

This year's "7-13" is meaningless without context. This wasn't a better team than last years or even the 2-16 team from 2016-2017.


Relative position matters too. They were middle of the pack, albeit barely. It was not a top year for the ACC, but we don't know how the five teams were going to do in the tournament. FSU was loaded and I thought they had a good chance to win it all. The roster on the 2-16 team, aside from Robinson and Bowman, was pretty bad. The team next year will have more depth than in years past if everybody is healthy.

They also had a couple of good moments during the season. Without two starters, they beat the defending national champions. They went on the road and won at UNC when they had their lottery pick return. But the out of conference losses, and the end of the season were brutal.

Re: New & Official Coaching Candidates Thread

PostPosted: Sun Apr 26, 2020 2:38 pm
by eepstein0
Are people really defending the recent record of performance of the basketball team?