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twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

Shaddix {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

BCEaglesFan {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:We used to have a coach that could win in a superconference with under recruited guys. Hopefully this guy will show that he can reach that level.

It's too bad that guy hasn't existed since 2006.

You keep telling me that. Reggie Jackson.

Who absolutely sucked under Skinner and was revived by Donahue.

This could be the dumbest thing I have ever seen posted.

Yea, that's not accurate. But he developed well under the Don.

Sometimes. When he wasn't pissing off the Don with his stubborness.

In a video with the Thunder Reggie said that the bost moment of his career was meeting Steve Donahue.

Don made a Reggie a star and a first-round draft pick. In Al Skinner's system Reggie was woefully out of place and was wasting his potential.

Oh, and evidently Purvis and Warren are better based on how great the hoops weirdos think NCSU is.

Heckmann and Jackson are legit ACC role players. That's just the end of it. Hanlan, Rahon, Anderson, Clifford are legit ACC starters, and Heck and Lonnie are legit ACC role players. Everyone else on the roster? Not so much. Odio has made strides and I think he can be serviceable if:
A) he sticks to the PF position, he will be serviceable by senior year.
B) if he develops a shot and can put in time at the 3 (again, by senior year).

I'd like to see what Suliamon could do with 40 mins a game, too.

BCEaglesFan {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

Shaddix {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

BCEaglesFan {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:We used to have a coach that could win in a superconference with under recruited guys. Hopefully this guy will show that he can reach that level.

It's too bad that guy hasn't existed since 2006.

You keep telling me that. Reggie Jackson.

Who absolutely sucked under Skinner and was revived by Donahue.

This could be the dumbest thing I have ever seen posted.

Yea, that's not accurate. But he developed well under the Don.

Sometimes. When he wasn't pissing off the Don with his stubborness.

In a video with the Thunder Reggie said that the bost moment of his career was meeting Steve Donahue.

Don made a Reggie a star and a first-round draft pick. In Al Skinner's system Reggie was woefully out of place and was wasting his potential.

Reggie Jackson was notorious for not listening to the Don and even was benched as a result. Your premise is idiotic.

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:BTW, i bet we surpass the vaunted 11-19 record that coach handsome reached in 1999 this year, with a team with a great freshman guard and no big man depth.

Glad we are aiming high. Let me know when we can bet on making the tourney 5 years in a row with a straight face.

You are going to HJSian levels of disingenuity. You say we are not making acceptable progress, then you say or imply that the last coach was satisfactory, but you discount the nearly identical progress. 1997 Skinner wins a little bit with JOB's player, 1998 Skinner has a miserable awful season with a mostly empty roster, 1999 Skinner's team shows progress but isn't ready yet. Other than having the benefit of hindsight for one and not the other the progress looks strikingly similar. Very few people would have bet on 5 straight tournament appearances on January 6, 2000.

So what you're saying is that the Don landed Troy Bell in this year's class?

No, but I think the combination of Hanlan, Rahon, Anderson and supporting cast could get you somewhere similar to where Bell, Sidney, Agbai and supporting cast did.

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

BCEaglesFan {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

Shaddix {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

BCEaglesFan {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:We used to have a coach that could win in a superconference with under recruited guys. Hopefully this guy will show that he can reach that level.

It's too bad that guy hasn't existed since 2006.

You keep telling me that. Reggie Jackson.

Who absolutely sucked under Skinner and was revived by Donahue.

This could be the dumbest thing I have ever seen posted.

Yea, that's not accurate. But he developed well under the Don.

Sometimes. When he wasn't pissing off the Don with his stubborness.

In a video with the Thunder Reggie said that the bost moment of his career was meeting Steve Donahue.

Don made a Reggie a star and a first-round draft pick. In Al Skinner's system Reggie was woefully out of place and was wasting his potential.

Reggie Jackson was notorious for not listening to the Don and even was benched as a result. Your premise is idiotic.

He was benched for one game and was an All-ACC first team player. He still supports BC and the Don openly. If they argued as much as you said Reggie would want the Don out and Reggie wouldn't play as much as he did.

BCEagles25 {l Wrote}:Heckmann and Jackson are legit ACC role players. That's just the end of it. Hanlan, Rahon, Anderson, Clifford are legit ACC starters, and Heck and Lonnie are legit ACC role players. Everyone else on the roster? Not so much. Odio has made strides and I think he can be serviceable if:
A) he sticks to the PF position, he will be serviceable by senior year.
B) if he develops a shot and can put in time at the 3 (again, by senior year).

Jackson for 10-15 minutes a night is good. For 30-35 minutes a night it's a disaster. Need Jorgensen for next year.

For what it's worth Heckmann is gone after this year anyway. Owens, Drago can fill his minutes fine.

Lastly, if we're banking on Dragevich being the savior, we're screwed. He's a good shooter, that's about it.

eepstein0 {l Wrote}:

BCEagles25 {l Wrote}:Heckmann and Jackson are legit ACC role players. That's just the end of it. Hanlan, Rahon, Anderson, Clifford are legit ACC starters, and Heck and Lonnie are legit ACC role players. Everyone else on the roster? Not so much. Odio has made strides and I think he can be serviceable if:
A) he sticks to the PF position, he will be serviceable by senior year.
B) if he develops a shot and can put in time at the 3 (again, by senior year).

Jackson for 10-15 minutes a night is good. For 30-35 minutes a night it's a disaster. Need Jorgensen for next year.

For what it's worth Heckmann is gone after this year anyway. Owens, Drago can fill his minutes fine.

Lastly, if we're banking on Dragevich being the savior, we're screwed. He's a good shooter, that's about it.

He's a great shooter, more consistent than Heckmann and that's all we need.

eepstein0 {l Wrote}:

BCEagles25 {l Wrote}:Heckmann and Jackson are legit ACC role players. That's just the end of it. Hanlan, Rahon, Anderson, Clifford are legit ACC starters, and Heck and Lonnie are legit ACC role players. Everyone else on the roster? Not so much. Odio has made strides and I think he can be serviceable if:
A) he sticks to the PF position, he will be serviceable by senior year.
B) if he develops a shot and can put in time at the 3 (again, by senior year).

Jackson for 10-15 minutes a night is good. For 30-35 minutes a night it's a disaster. Need Jorgensen for next year.

For what it's worth Heckmann is gone after this year anyway. Owens, Drago can fill his minutes fine.

Lastly, if we're banking on Dragevich being the savior, we're screwed. He's a good shooter, that's about it.

Is Heckmann gone more than speculation? I'd be more worried (both because it would actually be a loss and because it would be more like he'd actually make some decent $) if he consistently contributed this season. I'd imagine a BC degree holds much less cache to a German guy who is not going to live here, but I still don't think an early pro decision is a foregone conclusion.

I think Jackson is fine in his current role with some exceptions his minutes are not a disaster. He does have the most flaws of any starter though and if Jorgensen is legit it would certainly be an upgrade.

Drage- is depth not a savior. We need depth.

Thoroughly enjoying the argument overstatement by both sides. Carry on.

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:

eepstein0 {l Wrote}:

BCEagles25 {l Wrote}:Heckmann and Jackson are legit ACC role players. That's just the end of it. Hanlan, Rahon, Anderson, Clifford are legit ACC starters, and Heck and Lonnie are legit ACC role players. Everyone else on the roster? Not so much. Odio has made strides and I think he can be serviceable if:
A) he sticks to the PF position, he will be serviceable by senior year.
B) if he develops a shot and can put in time at the 3 (again, by senior year).

Jackson for 10-15 minutes a night is good. For 30-35 minutes a night it's a disaster. Need Jorgensen for next year.

For what it's worth Heckmann is gone after this year anyway. Owens, Drago can fill his minutes fine.

Lastly, if we're banking on Dragevich being the savior, we're screwed. He's a good shooter, that's about it.

Is Heckmann gone more than speculation? I'd be more worried (both because it would actually be a loss and because it would be more like he'd actually make some decent $) if he consistently contributed this season. I'd imagine a BC degree holds much less cache to a German guy who is not going to live here, but I still don't think an early pro decision is a foregone conclusion.

I think Jackson is fine in his current role with some exceptions his minutes are not a disaster. He does have the most flaws of any starter though and if Jorgensen is legit it would certainly be an upgrade.

Drage- is depth not a savior. We need depth.

Drago will likely start next year, or at least be the 6th man.

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:

eepstein0 {l Wrote}:

BCEagles25 {l Wrote}:Heckmann and Jackson are legit ACC role players. That's just the end of it. Hanlan, Rahon, Anderson, Clifford are legit ACC starters, and Heck and Lonnie are legit ACC role players. Everyone else on the roster? Not so much. Odio has made strides and I think he can be serviceable if:
A) he sticks to the PF position, he will be serviceable by senior year.
B) if he develops a shot and can put in time at the 3 (again, by senior year).

Jackson for 10-15 minutes a night is good. For 30-35 minutes a night it's a disaster. Need Jorgensen for next year.

For what it's worth Heckmann is gone after this year anyway. Owens, Drago can fill his minutes fine.

Lastly, if we're banking on Dragevich being the savior, we're screwed. He's a good shooter, that's about it.

Is Heckmann gone more than speculation? I'd be more worried (both because it would actually be a loss and because it would be more like he'd actually make some decent $) if he consistently contributed this season. I'd imagine a BC degree holds much less cache to a German guy who is not going to live here, but I still don't think an early pro decision is a foregone conclusion.

I think Jackson is fine in his current role with some exceptions his minutes are not a disaster. He does have the most flaws of any starter though and if Jorgensen is legit it would certainly be an upgrade.

Drage- is depth not a savior. We need depth.

I've heard it's more than speculation that Heckmann will not stay. He's still undecided.

tw could not be more correct. you say our freshman look so good bc theyre the only ones in the acc getting 35 a night. doesnt make them the best. hoops weirdos have such a distorted view of reality. clifford averaged 9/5 last year. hes averaging 5/5 this season. lets calm down about crowning him as a legit acc starter.

and how about lonnie jackson improves his shooting to above 1 out of 3 before we crown him a definite acc role player. if lonnie jackson was on duke hed be getting 5 minutes every other game. and give me a break on heckman.

and people who think/thought reggie and donahue got along could not be more mistaken.

commavegarage {l Wrote}:tw could not be more correct. you say our freshman look so good bc theyre the only ones in the acc getting 35 a night. doesnt make them the best. hoops weirdos have such a distorted view of reality. clifford averaged 9/5 last year. hes averaging 5/5 this season. lets calm down about crowning him as a legit acc starter.

and how about lonnie jackson improves his shooting to above 1 out of 3 before we crown him a definite acc role player. if lonnie jackson was on duke hed be getting 5 minutes every other game. and give me a break on heckman.

Rahon and Hanlan are holding their own against upperclassmen starters as freshman. It is entirely possible that many other ACC freshman who are blocked could do the same, but Rahon and Hanlan have and I believe will continue to do so. Plus outside of numbers, watching them play tells me they are good with all-acc not out of the question at some point for either.

Clifford is hurt and his limited minutes hurt his numbers but he looks like a decent contributor when he plays, moreover to add some perspective, his freshman 9 and 5 which you dismiss, is better than Uka Agbai's freshman year 6 and 5 and sophomore year 9 and 4, is better than Nasty Nate ever did in a season even his senior year where he was OK, it is better than any of Oates, Williams or McClains freshman or sophomore years (although they split minutes), and its better than Southern ever averaged. Out of centers from the Skinner era, Williams junior year and Agbai's junior and senior year are the only better performances statistically, unless you want to count Smith as a center.

Jackson is a limited player and is having a bad shooting season, but one which has improved since an awful beginning. I don't know why the people who say he's a bad shooter refuse to look at his .399 2011 season on 143 attempts though. For perspective he had 5 less 3s made than Pierre Jackson from Baylor on the same exact amount of attempts. That is not bad and it did happen.

Commave has absolutely no idea what he is talking about with Reggie Jackson. I don't want to get into the whole story, in fact I think I have already shared bits and pieces of it, but this is one area where my sources are pretty good.

MattTheEagle {l Wrote}:Commave has absolutely no idea what he is talking about with Reggie Jackson. I don't want to get into the whole story, in fact I think I have already shared bits and pieces of it, but this is one area where my sources are pretty good.

im not wrong on these things. ask anyone here that isn't a weirdo.

MattTheEagle {l Wrote}:Commave has absolutely no idea what he is talking about with Reggie Jackson. I don't want to get into the whole story, in fact I think I have already shared bits and pieces of it, but this is one area where my sources are pretty good.

Whether he and Don played X-box together after practice or had a Spaz-Rogers moment in the clubhouse really doesn't matter because the origin of this sub-argument, that Jackson stunk before Donahue got to BC is patently incorrect.

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:

MattTheEagle {l Wrote}:Commave has absolutely no idea what he is talking about with Reggie Jackson. I don't want to get into the whole story, in fact I think I have already shared bits and pieces of it, but this is one area where my sources are pretty good.

Whether he and Don played X-box together after practice or had a Spaz-Rogers moment in the clubhouse really doesn't matter because the origin of this sub-argument, that Jackson stunk before Donahue got to BC is patently incorrect.

this is correct.

to add to the Jackson equation. The subtraction of Rakim's 10.3 often terrible field goal attempts per game from 2009-2010 likely had as much of a positive effect on Jackson's game as Donahue.

Jackson was not terrible under Skinner but he got better across the board under Donahue. Donahue did pretty good things with a 15-16 team that lost its second best player.

This thread now sucks.

DavidGordonsFoot {l Wrote}:This thread now sucks.

This post is about 4 hours late.

BCEaglesFan {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

BCEaglesFan {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

Shaddix {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

BCEaglesFan {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:We used to have a coach that could win in a superconference with under recruited guys. Hopefully this guy will show that he can reach that level.

It's too bad that guy hasn't existed since 2006.

You keep telling me that. Reggie Jackson.

Who absolutely sucked under Skinner and was revived by Donahue.

This could be the dumbest thing I have ever seen posted.

Yea, that's not accurate. But he developed well under the Don.

Sometimes. When he wasn't pissing off the Don with his stubborness.

In a video with the Thunder Reggie said that the bost moment of his career was meeting Steve Donahue.

Don made a Reggie a star and a first-round draft pick. In Al Skinner's system Reggie was woefully out of place and was wasting his potential.

Reggie Jackson was notorious for not listening to the Don and even was benched as a result. Your premise is idiotic.

He was benched for one game and was an All-ACC first team player. He still supports BC and the Don openly. If they argued as much as you said Reggie would want the Don out and Reggie wouldn't play as much as he did.

Your premise that is retarded is that he was a bad player under Al or that Don somehow made him something that he wasn't already. People's memories suck.

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

BCEaglesFan {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

BCEaglesFan {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

Shaddix {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

BCEaglesFan {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:We used to have a coach that could win in a superconference with under recruited guys. Hopefully this guy will show that he can reach that level.

It's too bad that guy hasn't existed since 2006.

You keep telling me that. Reggie Jackson.

Who absolutely sucked under Skinner and was revived by Donahue.

This could be the dumbest thing I have ever seen posted.

Yea, that's not accurate. But he developed well under the Don.

Sometimes. When he wasn't pissing off the Don with his stubborness.

In a video with the Thunder Reggie said that the bost moment of his career was meeting Steve Donahue.

Don made a Reggie a star and a first-round draft pick. In Al Skinner's system Reggie was woefully out of place and was wasting his potential.

Reggie Jackson was notorious for not listening to the Don and even was benched as a result. Your premise is idiotic.

He was benched for one game and was an All-ACC first team player. He still supports BC and the Don openly. If they argued as much as you said Reggie would want the Don out and Reggie wouldn't play as much as he did.

Your premise that is retarded is that he was a bad player under Al or that Don somehow made him something that he wasn't already. People's memories suck.

Reggie shot 27% and 29% in two seasons under Al from three point range. He then shot 42% under the Don. You can argue the reasons" but he was definitely something the last season that he was not previously, a complete scorer from all areas of he floor.

Anyone else having trouble figuring out who is reacting to whom? I started by thinking commavegarage thinking this was a bad effort that he was disappointed in was ridiculous, but there are also polyannas who are thrilled as a pig in shit by a near win to an ACC team and maybe he was responding to that?

It's hard to stay with reality, which is that we don't know what this team is yet, when one group is declaring success (as opposed to improvement, which is beyond argument) and another is declaring failure.

2001Eagle {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

BCEaglesFan {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

BCEaglesFan {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

Shaddix {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

BCEaglesFan {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:We used to have a coach that could win in a superconference with under recruited guys. Hopefully this guy will show that he can reach that level.

It's too bad that guy hasn't existed since 2006.

You keep telling me that. Reggie Jackson.

Who absolutely sucked under Skinner and was revived by Donahue.

This could be the dumbest thing I have ever seen posted.

Yea, that's not accurate. But he developed well under the Don.

Sometimes. When he wasn't pissing off the Don with his stubborness.

In a video with the Thunder Reggie said that the bost moment of his career was meeting Steve Donahue.

Don made a Reggie a star and a first-round draft pick. In Al Skinner's system Reggie was woefully out of place and was wasting his potential.

Reggie Jackson was notorious for not listening to the Don and even was benched as a result. Your premise is idiotic.

He was benched for one game and was an All-ACC first team player. He still supports BC and the Don openly. If they argued as much as you said Reggie would want the Don out and Reggie wouldn't play as much as he did.

Your premise that is retarded is that he was a bad player under Al or that Don somehow made him something that he wasn't already. People's memories suck.

Reggie shot 27% and 29% in two seasons under Al from three point range. He then shot 42% under the Don. You can argue the reasons" but he was definitely something the last season that he was not previously, a complete scorer from all areas of he floor.

Yep. The following statements are true:

1) Reggie did not suck in the 2008-2009 season;
2) Reggie improved significantly between the 2008-2009 season and the 2010-2011 season.

Everything else is arguable, especially the role of Donahue in he improvement.

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:

2001Eagle {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

BCEaglesFan {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

BCEaglesFan {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

Shaddix {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

BCEaglesFan {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:We used to have a coach that could win in a superconference with under recruited guys. Hopefully this guy will show that he can reach that level.

It's too bad that guy hasn't existed since 2006.

You keep telling me that. Reggie Jackson.

Who absolutely sucked under Skinner and was revived by Donahue.

This could be the dumbest thing I have ever seen posted.

Yea, that's not accurate. But he developed well under the Don.

Sometimes. When he wasn't pissing off the Don with his stubborness.

In a video with the Thunder Reggie said that the bost moment of his career was meeting Steve Donahue.

Don made a Reggie a star and a first-round draft pick. In Al Skinner's system Reggie was woefully out of place and was wasting his potential.

Reggie Jackson was notorious for not listening to the Don and even was benched as a result. Your premise is idiotic.

He was benched for one game and was an All-ACC first team player. He still supports BC and the Don openly. If they argued as much as you said Reggie would want the Don out and Reggie wouldn't play as much as he did.

Your premise that is retarded is that he was a bad player under Al or that Don somehow made him something that he wasn't already. People's memories suck.

Reggie shot 27% and 29% in two seasons under Al from three point range. He then shot 42% under the Don. You can argue the reasons" but he was definitely something the last season that he was not previously, a complete scorer from all areas of he floor.

Yep. The following statements are true:

1) Reggie did not suck in the 2008-2009 season;
2) Reggie improved significantly between the 2008-2009 season and the 2010-2011 season.

Everything else is arguable, especially the role of Donahue in he improvement.

Reggie also went from about a 43% overall shooter to a 50% shooter his final year at BC. And from 73-74% to 80% at the stripe. He improved markedly that last year. Probably a combination of natural improvement arc for a great player and the more open system under Don, but Reggie would have not have been an NBA draft pick without that huge jump in his last season. Part of it could quite well have been Don's coaching.

[stands up, puts down scotch glass, pulls out monocle, huffs on monocle, polishes monocle with handkerchief, examines monocle at arm's length, puts monocle back in, looks out window, puts thumbs in suspenders, clears throat, straightens bowler hat]

"Hoops weirdos are weird indeed."