To the condemners of basketball recruiting...

[RedBaron67]

Anderson was a great get and as inconsistent as he is Matt Humphrey was a good transfer. Clifford's close and could have used another year to develop but the situation we're in forced him to play 30 minutes a game instead of 10. He's already better than at least a 1/3 of the big-men in the ACC. I'll also give you Hanlan, he's a high major recruit. Heckmann is a wildcard but had Michigan & Maryland offers.

Aside from that, you have a big collection of mid-major players, who coincidentally were only recruited by mid-major schools except for BC (Daniels, Jackson, Caudill, Odio & Moton). With the style we play, this mix of talent may work out, but to pretend the 2011 or 2012 recruiting classes, which were ranked dead last in the conference both years, was some overwhelming success is incorrect. Instead of 5* recruiting and 2* coaching, we've got it the other way around.

I really see 3 major issues with this team, one of which Hanlan will fix. The PG play has been sketchy at best. Daniels playing less minutes as a spark-plug guard off the bench will be beneficial. Hanlan is a pretty strong kid, should be able to contribute immediately. The other problems (shot creation and rebounding) have not been addressed at all in recruiting. BC still needs 1 more player in 2012, we're going to have the same scoring problems and the same rebounding problems next year unless something is addressed.

Can't possibly disagree more with your assessment of Jackson and Daniels. I also think pointing to recruiting class rankings continues to be retarded. I agree with your assessment of the rest of the players.

Based on what I saw on the court, Anderson, Clifford, Jackson and Daniels were a home run recruiting wise. Humphrey was an excellent transfer. Heckmann doesn't impress me much and worst of all, he makes it worse when 90% of his passes and shots are either lazy or need mustard. Caudill is just fine off of the bench, and Moton is okay in limited minutes.

For me, the only wasted schollies was Odio, but with the number of schollies he gave out in two seasons, you are bound to have a few misses. The idea that the Don hasn't done a good job recruiting is stupid.

You're looking at this team with very heavily rose-tinted glasses. I agree entirely with eepstein0 about Jackson and Daniels; they figure at best as useful role players on any respectable ACC team. Caudill will have to remove a lot of lard to accomplish even that much. Humphrey has some talent, but is extremely streaky and unreliable; he was like that at Oregon, and a transfer year of practice plus a season of play at BC hasn't changed him. Moton and Odio aren't even worth talking about at present, and have a very long way to go before they become so.

I also agree with him about the team's glaring needs. Hanlan might possibly help with shot creation if he can penetrate and dish, but that still leaves a desperate need for someone to go get the ball on the boards; Gill or January might help, but the prospect of getting either one is iffy at best.

This team didn't repeatedly get blown out in pre-conference play or finish last in the ACC just because they were mostly freshmen; this team has conspicuous deficiencies which physical maturation alone won't eliminate. As tiresome as the mantra "ACC talent" may be, reality is that a certain level of ability on the team is necessary in order to win with any consistency in a high-major conference. Recruiting is the meat and potatoes of college basketball, and the rest is secondary; coaching may make the difference in getting to the Final Four, but recruiting is what gets a team into the NCAA Tournament with a respectable seeding on a regular basis. Skinner and his assistants produced a string of tournament teams by finding overlooked players with high-major or even All-American potential; Donahue and his assistants (especially after Jones' departure) still have to prove that they can do as much. They may do so spectacularly within the next year or two, but they haven't yet. This is plain present fact, and it would be really foolish not to acknowledge it.

Hmmm Rose colored glasses or a Fan full of shit (“roflmao” no matter how I play with this wordplay)
With all the crap hitting the so called fan around these young Eagles they may never figure out how to get this thing turned around.
I digress… back to the subject at hand.
These young players…. The good the bad and the ugly of it.
The Good
These kids are good, all of them. Some better than others that’s a given and all of them have areas to improve on (I’ll get to that in the bad). I think these guys showed the world what kind of men they are with the effort they put out on and off the court as freshman. Like it or not guys they have proven themselves to be not only decent ACC players but better than a lot of ACC caliper players final ACC stat sheet will confirm that.
The Bad
You might want to check…there may still be some poop on your fan if you discount the difference in age of this team vs it’s opponents. I am the last one to excuse them for being young …seniors just have a lot more “git er done” in them than freshman do. They lost some games that could have earn The Don C.O.Y. nomination had they won. (19) Anderson’s matchup in the 1st NCState game turned 27 the night before the game.

Daniels simply needs to tighten up his dribble. He needs to get his hand on top of the ball instead of that west coast carry dribble it’s just to easy to time and pick.

The addition of the additional guards and some competition for the PG job will do him good. It will also do Jackson some good; he only needs to improve his defense he got taken off the dribble to easily and must learn to move his feet.

You are as wrong about your assessment of these two guys as you were about BC’s chances of winning this year.
The Ugly
Recruiting Last I checked the Don’s 1st class got a win over a ranked opponent, he had four guys on the ACC freshman watch one that made the ALL Frosh team and was 2nd to Rivers for F.o.Y. The rest of those that had 10+mins per game contributed and their actual ACC stats will show how many unquestionable ACC players they out performed this year.
As was previously stated recruiting is critical. The cover up at guard seems to have been addressed which should open up the offense properly. As stated a little competition for minutes will work wonders. The real ugly of it is in the 3,4,5… not for BC but for their opponents. Did you see the UNC game? Their freshman got major minutes and looked like ours did in Dec; this too should turn out well for BC basketball next year. I am sure these guys will be as average as the next freshman going into their sophomore year when it comes to working out and they should fair as well or not better than most. This team has a solid core /a ship and a crew add a few more and there is no telling what they can do!

One point: the BC freshmen's stats aren't properly comparable to those of most other ACC freshmen, because, of necessity, they got much more playing time.

That said, we''ll have to wait for next season to see whose assessment is confirmed by results. The more optimistic outlook suggests that they should at least come close to .500. I hope you optimists are right, but I don't think so.

[HJS]

I can see how reasonable minds can differ on Donahue's recruiting thus far. He has a few hits... a few mehs... and a few misses. No one in the incoming class is elite and he completely ignored the need for another big. Under Don, BC has been as woefully unsuccessful in mining local talent as Skinner (who was crucified for it). His first class was atrocious... which was made worse by missing out/running off kids Skinner landed that could be helping us now.

Here is a run-down of his recruits and my 2-cent evaluation:
Ryan Anderson - ACC starter
Dennis Clifford - ACC starter
Lonnie Jackson - ACC role player
Jordan Daniels - ACC role player
KC Caudill - ACC bench player
Patrick Heckmann - ACC bench player
Edio Odio - mid-major
Gabe Moton - mid-major

I see 2 excellent ACC recruits, 2 average ACC recruits, 2 projects and 2 misses. At best, Rohan and Hanlan fall into the "average ACC recruit" at this point (see BC finishing dead last in the recruiting rankings). Ideally, you would have seen Don build significantly upon last year's class with at least one elite player who we could slot into the rotation. That has been disappointing.

[eagle9903]

I can see how reasonable minds can differ on Donahue's recruiting thus far. He has a few hits... a few mehs... and a few misses. No one in the incoming class is elite and he completely ignored the need for another big. Under Don, BC has been as woefully unsuccessful in mining local talent as Skinner (who was crucified for it). His first class was atrocious... which was made worse by missing out/running off kids Skinner landed that could be helping us now.

Here is a run-down of his recruits and my 2-cent evaluation:
Ryan Anderson - ACC starter
Dennis Clifford - ACC starter
Lonnie Jackson - ACC role player
Jordan Daniels - ACC role player
KC Caudill - ACC bench player
Patrick Heckmann - ACC bench player
Edio Odio - mid-major
Gabe Moton - mid-major

I see 2 excellent ACC recruits, 2 average ACC recruits, 2 projects and 2 misses. At best, Rohan and Hanlan fall into the "average ACC recruit" at this point (see BC finishing dead last in the recruiting rankings). Ideally, you would have seen Don build significantly upon last year's class with at least one elite player who we could slot into the rotation. That has been disappointing.

1) The first class - Counting the first class makes little sense due to the time of the hiring, but if you need to for your Gene agenda go nuts. Moton isn't great.
2) The missing 2010 class - Noreen is a non factor, the other two Skinner 2010 recruits would probably be helpful for depth if nothing else. Heslip at BC would not be Heslip at Baylor yet, but they'd all be better than Moton and Rubin. The 2010 class probably makes this a 12 or 13 win team this season.
3) Local Players - Clifford is a local player who you project to be an ACC starter and call an excellent recruit, Hanlon is from a new england prep school and is projected to be good. Al's last New England recruit was Marquez Haynes. This criticism doesn't make sense. Additionally, it was a stupid criticism when it was made about Al, which was propogated by idiots like OJ so adopting it to suit your agenda now is disingenuous.
4)I don't know what the difference between your role player and bench player designation is, but I mostly agree with your assessment of what the ceiling for the 2011 recruits looks to be. I'd probably say Jackson could be a starter on a good team, with a big PG like Hanlon depending on development, but otherwise no real disagreement. Heckmann, in my opinion, could e a starter or could be gone after the summer, I just don't know what he is due to his sickness.
5) The 2012 class is not necessarily finished yet re: not getting a big.
6) Counting Hanlon and Rahon as average ACC recruits before they play doesn't mean much, since before last season Clifford would have fallen into this category and was ranked below average but after a season you call him an "excellent" recruit.

Please name the "elite" recruits BC has gotten since 1998. It's a short list, consisting of a fat guy who just finished at Fairfield, so this shouldn't be hard.

The bottomline is these kids could absolutely end up never developing, I'm completely aware of this and thus he could be proven to be a terrible recruiter. He could end up not getting "elite" on paper talent AND not being able to find and develop under recruited players.

It is just stupid, however, to come out right now and say Donahue is recruiting non-ACC talent or that he "miscalculated the level of talent" needed. That makes no sense it ignores Dudleys, Bells, Jacksons and Rices. Unless you want to pretend that prior to him getting here BC got McDonald's AAs every season. He could be doing the same kind of recruiting Skinner did in his good years, but you don't know that until the kid's (preferably more than one class of them) play.

[HJS]

To explain my categories... "ACC starter" means he would start for any ACC team (obviously his role would vary from being a solid contributor at Duke/UNC to being a potential star at BC). "ACC role player" means that he would have a specific role (e.g. spot shooter, rebounder, etc.) on most ACC rosters (some as starter, some as 6th or 7th man), but not a star. ACC bench player is someone who is more of a project that is a reserve on most ACC clubs unless they dramatically develop over the years.

I think that the idea of Donahue "miscalculating" recruiting comes from the perception that Donahue feels comfortable just rolling with his system (regardless of who he gets). I think some of that is born from comments made by Donahue, GDF and others who cite to his Cornell success. I think some of it comes from having an entire staff full of no-name assistants with absolutely zero combined experience at high major programs. Finally, I think some of it comes from BC not being a major player for known elite players.

As for judging Hanlan and Olivier... you can't. But, their lack of acclaim just reinforces the perception that Don is not putting a huge emphasis on recruiting elite players. BTW... while we can all scoff at the inaccuracies of recruiting (which is pronounced in hoops), it should be noted that BC's representative on the ACC All Frosh Team was the one recruit that every publication was impressed that BC was able to land.

[Shaddix]

I can see how reasonable minds can differ on Donahue's recruiting thus far. He has a few hits... a few mehs... and a few misses. No one in the incoming class is elite and he completely ignored the need for another big. Under Don, BC has been as woefully unsuccessful in mining local talent as Skinner (who was crucified for it). His first class was atrocious... which was made worse by missing out/running off kids Skinner landed that could be helping us now.

Here is a run-down of his recruits and my 2-cent evaluation:
Ryan Anderson - ACC starter
Dennis Clifford - ACC starter
Lonnie Jackson - ACC role player
Jordan Daniels - ACC role player
KC Caudill - ACC bench player
Patrick Heckmann - ACC bench player
Edio Odio - mid-major
Gabe Moton - mid-major

I see 2 excellent ACC recruits, 2 average ACC recruits, 2 projects and 2 misses. At best, Rohan and Hanlan fall into the "average ACC recruit" at this point (see BC finishing dead last in the recruiting rankings). Ideally, you would have seen Don build significantly upon last year's class with at least one elite player who we could slot into the rotation. That has been disappointing.

Agreed with everything besides Heckmann. Heckmann will be an ACC starter. He had mental/turnover issues, but his back pain really set him back in development.

[eagle9903]

To explain my categories... "ACC starter" means he would start for any ACC team (obviously his role would vary from being a solid contributor at Duke/UNC to being a potential star at BC). "ACC role player" means that he would have a specific role (e.g. spot shooter, rebounder, etc.) on most ACC rosters (some as starter, some as 6th or 7th man), but not a star. ACC bench player is someone who is more of a project that is a reserve on most ACC clubs unless they dramatically develop over the years.

that's pretty much what I figured and that sounds right to me, with the caveat about Heckmann in my earlier post.

I think that the idea of Donahue "miscalculating" recruiting comes from the perception that Donahue feels comfortable just rolling with his system (regardless of who he gets). I think some of that is born from comments made by Donahue, GDF and others who cite to his Cornell success. I think some of it comes from having an entire staff full of no-name assistants with absolutely zero combined experience at high major programs. Finally, I think some of it comes from BC not being a major player for known elite players.

I think the assistants lack of high major experience is potentially troubling, but is similar to Skinner's early staff's experience. I don't read much into the comments and just hope GDF stays away. BC has only been a major player with elite players like twice in twenty five years, one time it ended with JOB leaving and the other time it just didn't go anywhere. I hope we can get to the point where we can get elite players. I do think certain coaches could probably do it at BC without succeeding on the court first, like Cooley as HC, but most would have to win first.

As for judging Hanlan and Olivier... you can't. But, their lack of acclaim just reinforces the perception that Don is not putting a huge emphasis on recruiting elite players. BTW... while we can all scoff at the inaccuracies of recruiting (which is pronounced in hoops), it should be noted that BC's representative on the ACC All Frosh Team was the one recruit that every publication was impressed that BC was able to land.

My disagreement here is based partially upon reading good things about Hanlan that lead me to believe he is similar to an Al find, for instance that he was the best player on a loaded New Hampton Prep team his senior year, that he got better in the playoffs, etc. Its also based partially on the fact that he is not a bad recruit on paper either, he has Dayton and Va Tech offers and if he hadn't signed early (his LOI is already in) he might have some huge offers after the way he's been playing since January. Rahon, I know literally nothing about except he got hurt badly his junior year, I read his high school team is shitty, and his brother starts and contributes but is not a star for a decent tourney team at SDSU. If the publications got Anderson right, they got Clifford the most wrong. I'm certainly not saying they're always wrong.

[bchockey04]

As for judging Hanlan and Olivier... you can't. But, their lack of acclaim just reinforces the perception that Don is not putting a huge emphasis on recruiting elite players. BTW... while we can all scoff at the inaccuracies of recruiting (which is pronounced in hoops), it should be noted that BC's representative on the ACC All Frosh Team was the one recruit that every publication was impressed that BC was able to land.

Actually...Hanlan is now getting plenty of acclaim.

But there needs to be a 3rd person (preferably someone taller than 6'4" -- so i don't entirely disagree.

[HJS]

To be clear... I don't necessarily subscribe to the "Donahue underestimates the need for talent" school of thought. I am just saying I can understand where it is coming from (and that it has some merit).

Personally, I need to see how good Hanlan and Rahon are... and who we sign in the Fall.

In my opinion, the class of Anderson, Clifford, Jackson, Daniels, Heckmann and Caudill is as good a 4+ person class BC could ever hope for. I was very excited about the class all last Spring and they met expectations. I think Rahon and Olivier are solid recruits (though I am not as excited about them as I was last year's class). I am disappointed that Don didn't land an elite player in this class. I am also disappointed that Don didn't address forward. I would've loved to have seen a scoring SF or a rebounding/defending PF in this class. Quite simply, an elite player or a scoring 3/rebounding 4 would've very nicely complemented what we already have... and could've set BC up for a magical run in the near future.

[eagle9903]

To be clear... I don't necessarily subscribe to the "Donahue underestimates the need for talent" school of thought. I am just saying I can understand where it is coming from (and that it has some merit).

Personally, I need to see how good Hanlan and Rahon are... and who we sign in the Fall.

In my opinion, the class of Anderson, Clifford, Jackson, Daniels, Heckmann and Caudill is as good a 4+ person class BC could ever hope for. I was very excited about the class all last Spring and they met expectations. I think Rahon and Olivier are solid recruits (though I am not as excited about them as I was last year's class). I am disappointed that Don didn't land an elite player in this class. I am also disappointed that Don didn't address forward. I would've loved to have seen a scoring SF or a rebounding/defending PF in this class. Quite simply, an elite player or a scoring 3/rebounding 4 would've very nicely complemented what we already have... and could've set BC up for a magical run in the near future.

I don't understand how people, not you, can condemn recruiting yet. I certainly understand questioning how it's going and I don't think it's anywhere approaching clear that Donahue is as good as a recruiter as Skinner (including staffs). Skinner proved it, Donahue hasn't but also hasn't had a chance to.

I want a forward in this class, as I mentioned previously I wouldn't be shocked for it to still happen. I'd always like elite recruits, but can't kill the guy for not doing something that almost no one at the school has ever done.

[twballgame9]

I can see how reasonable minds can differ on Donahue's recruiting thus far. He has a few hits... a few mehs... and a few misses. No one in the incoming class is elite and he completely ignored the need for another big. Under Don, BC has been as woefully unsuccessful in mining local talent as Skinner (who was crucified for it). His first class was atrocious... which was made worse by missing out/running off kids Skinner landed that could be helping us now.

Here is a run-down of his recruits and my 2-cent evaluation:
Ryan Anderson - ACC starter
Dennis Clifford - ACC starter
Lonnie Jackson - ACC role player
Jordan Daniels - ACC role player
KC Caudill - ACC bench player
Patrick Heckmann - ACC bench player
Edio Odio - mid-major
Gabe Moton - mid-major

I see 2 excellent ACC recruits, 2 average ACC recruits, 2 projects and 2 misses. At best, Rohan and Hanlan fall into the "average ACC recruit" at this point (see BC finishing dead last in the recruiting rankings). Ideally, you would have seen Don build significantly upon last year's class with at least one elite player who we could slot into the rotation. That has been disappointing.

Agreed with everything besides Heckmann. Heckmann will be an ACC starter. He had mental/turnover issues, but his back pain really set him back in development.

I hate everything about Heckmann's game. Thinks he's a street ball player and has 0 street ball skills. Someone needs to teach him how to play actual basketball.

[eepstein0]

Hanlan will be in that elite category someday.

[Bender]

Heckmann could be a valuable player on a team with a good point guard to create offense. His shooting would be more valuable and hopefully he would be more likely to play within himself instead of trying to do more than he is able, which resulted in way too many turnovers. I wouldn't be surprised if he had a better career at BC than either Jackson or Daniels.

[eagleman99]

3) Local Players - Clifford is a local player who you project to be an ACC starter and call an excellent recruit, Hanlon is from a new england prep school and is projected to be good. Al's last New England recruit was Marquez Haynes. This criticism doesn't make sense. Additionally, it was a stupid criticism when it was made about Al, which was propogated by idiots like OJ so adopting it to suit your agenda now is disingenuous.

Marquez Haynes was from Texas.

[eagle9903]

3) Local Players - Clifford is a local player who you project to be an ACC starter and call an excellent recruit, Hanlon is from a new england prep school and is projected to be good. Al's last New England recruit was Marquez Haynes. This criticism doesn't make sense. Additionally, it was a stupid criticism when it was made about Al, which was propogated by idiots like OJ so adopting it to suit your agenda now is disingenuous.

Marquez Haynes was from Texas.

Meant hailey

[eepstein0]

If we could find a way to get Anthony January on campus next Fall I'd feel better about the prospects of next year.

[Shaddix]

I can see how reasonable minds can differ on Donahue's recruiting thus far. He has a few hits... a few mehs... and a few misses. No one in the incoming class is elite and he completely ignored the need for another big. Under Don, BC has been as woefully unsuccessful in mining local talent as Skinner (who was crucified for it). His first class was atrocious... which was made worse by missing out/running off kids Skinner landed that could be helping us now.

Here is a run-down of his recruits and my 2-cent evaluation:
Ryan Anderson - ACC starter
Dennis Clifford - ACC starter
Lonnie Jackson - ACC role player
Jordan Daniels - ACC role player
KC Caudill - ACC bench player
Patrick Heckmann - ACC bench player
Edio Odio - mid-major
Gabe Moton - mid-major

I see 2 excellent ACC recruits, 2 average ACC recruits, 2 projects and 2 misses. At best, Rohan and Hanlan fall into the "average ACC recruit" at this point (see BC finishing dead last in the recruiting rankings). Ideally, you would have seen Don build significantly upon last year's class with at least one elite player who we could slot into the rotation. That has been disappointing.

Agreed with everything besides Heckmann. Heckmann will be an ACC starter. He had mental/turnover issues, but his back pain really set him back in development.

I hate everything about Heckmann's game. Thinks he's a street ball player and has 0 street ball skills. Someone needs to teach him how to play actual basketball.

You hate a 6'5 slasher with the ability to shoot, hit free throws and distribute the ball while driving? He looks a bit like Lesley on NC State if you ask me. Once he slows his game down a bit, he won't turn the ball over as much. He needs the offseason to gain confidence from that miserable end to the season. He is a lock to start his junior year and by the second half of next year, he should average about 7 ppg and 5 assists off the bench.

[BCEagles25]

I can see how reasonable minds can differ on Donahue's recruiting thus far. He has a few hits... a few mehs... and a few misses. No one in the incoming class is elite and he completely ignored the need for another big. Under Don, BC has been as woefully unsuccessful in mining local talent as Skinner (who was crucified for it). His first class was atrocious... which was made worse by missing out/running off kids Skinner landed that could be helping us now.

Here is a run-down of his recruits and my 2-cent evaluation:
Ryan Anderson - ACC starter
Dennis Clifford - ACC starter
Lonnie Jackson - ACC role player
Jordan Daniels - ACC role player
KC Caudill - ACC bench player
Patrick Heckmann - ACC bench player
Edio Odio - mid-major
Gabe Moton - mid-major

I see 2 excellent ACC recruits, 2 average ACC recruits, 2 projects and 2 misses. At best, Rohan and Hanlan fall into the "average ACC recruit" at this point (see BC finishing dead last in the recruiting rankings). Ideally, you would have seen Don build significantly upon last year's class with at least one elite player who we could slot into the rotation. That has been disappointing.

Agreed with everything besides Heckmann. Heckmann will be an ACC starter. He had mental/turnover issues, but his back pain really set him back in development.

I hate everything about Heckmann's game. Thinks he's a street ball player and has 0 street ball skills. Someone needs to teach him how to play actual basketball.

This is, in all honest and with all due respect, just a terrible analysis of Patrick Heckmann. He tries to drive to the basket, but it goes off his foot sometimes. He just needs to learn to dribble, and he'll be at the very least ACC role player material (he already is.) His passing is also very shitty. Look for a different, healthy Heckmann next year if he's still here.

[eagleman99]

3) Local Players - Clifford is a local player who you project to be an ACC starter and call an excellent recruit, Hanlon is from a new england prep school and is projected to be good. Al's last New England recruit was Marquez Haynes. This criticism doesn't make sense. Additionally, it was a stupid criticism when it was made about Al, which was propogated by idiots like OJ so adopting it to suit your agenda now is disingenuous.

Marquez Haynes was from Texas.

Meant hailey

AKA the master of the 3 on 1 fast break.

[HJS]

Is Rhode Island still considered part of New England?

[JConman]

Is Rhode Island still considered part of New England?

Yeah but he's the fat guy who finished up at Fairfield so we apparently don't count him.

[eagle9903]

Is Rhode Island still considered part of New England?

Yeah but he's the fat guy who finished up at Fairfield so we apparently don't count him.

Address the rest of it.

[eagle9903]

Is Rhode Island still considered part of New England?

Yeah but he's the fat guy who finished up at Fairfield so we apparently don't count him.

Something I've wondered for awhile. Are you HJS's PM buddy from EA? I've always thought you probably were, if so, I'm glad you're so dedicated to keeping your buddy informed. I'm also glad he let you out of the trunk to come display your witticisms over here.

I'm aware at this point that I fucked up my designations of New England vs. Massachusetts in my posts up above. I don't think that matters in the scheme of things because as I said the "mining local talent" criticism of Al was an OJ tactic. I never gave a shit that Craig Smith was from California instead of Falls River or Troy Bell was from Minnesota instead of Woburn and neither should anyone else. Only idiots subscribed to that ridiculousness. Therefore, pretending it is a solid reasoning now is stupid. Further, if you insist on pursuing OJ rationale then here's another shot at it:

Al in 13 years:
1998: Brian Ross: MA
2000: Jermaine Watson: MA
2003: Steve Hailey: MA
2006: Tyler Roche: NH
2007: Rakim Sanders: RI
2010: Brady Heslip: NH(prep) before Donahue pissed on his grandfather's grave so that he could sign Gabe Moton instead

.462 local recruits per year

Donahue in 2-3 years:
Dennis Clifford: MA
Olivier Hanlan: NH(Prep)

.667 local recruits per year

The conclusion: Nothing, because it's still a stupid point.

[bignick33]

The other afternoon, I was having a beer at a bar in the financial district while watching the NCAA Tourney. I was wearing a BC polo because I was heading to the Garden for the BC/PC game later in the afternoon. A middle-aged suit who was drinking a glass of white wine at the bar asked me if I was a BC grad, then followed to comment to be "BC never should have fired O'Brien." Assuming that the comment was derived from recent Metro articles but not wanting to get too defensive, I somewhat flippantly replied "well, it's looking more and more like given the state of the program...it's too bad that the guy who followed him couldn't get along with the asshole AD as he had assembled a hell of a staff and was more successful in his two years than O'Brien ever was" or something along those lines. The suit replied "No, I was talking about Jimmy...they never should have canned him", to which I replied especially not wanting to bark down that tree, "that was before my time, but I do remember the upsets over UNC and Indiana."

I don't know why this thread made me remember that brief conversation, but in the context of NE vs. non NE recruiting, it seems somewhat illustrative.

[ATLeagle]

It amazes me that there are people who still look back fondly on JOB. As many of the posters here can tell you (because we were students), JOB was a terrible game coach. He developed some talent but not enough over 11 years. We were really bad at times. His record at BC and Ohio State without Scoonie Penn is below .500. He's scorched the earth at two schools and wasn't that great of a guy. If not for his buddy buddy relationship with the Boston media, he would have been killed for all he did and didn't do at BC.

[eagle9903]

It amazes me that there are people who still look back fondly on JOB. As many of the posters here can tell you (because we were students), JOB was a terrible game coach. He developed some talent but not enough over 11 years. We were really bad at times. His record at BC and Ohio State without Scoonie Penn is below .500. He's scorched the earth at two schools and wasn't that great of a guy. If not for his buddy buddy relationship with the Boston media, he would have been killed for all he did and didn't do at BC.

For people who were not students at the time or didn't pay much attention, I think they just remember the second most iconic image in BC sports history:

[claver2010]

The other afternoon, I was having a beer at a bar in the financial district while watching the NCAA Tourney. I was wearing a BC polo because I was heading to the Garden for the BC/PC game later in the afternoon. A middle-aged suit who was drinking a glass of white wine at the bar asked me if I was a BC grad, then followed to comment to be "BC never should have fired O'Brien." Assuming that the comment was derived from recent Metro articles but not wanting to get too defensive, I somewhat flippantly replied "well, it's looking more and more like given the state of the program...it's too bad that the guy who followed him couldn't get along with the asshole AD as he had assembled a hell of a staff and was more successful in his two years than O'Brien ever was" or something along those lines. The suit replied "No, I was talking about Jimmy...they never should have canned him", to which I replied especially not wanting to bark down that tree, "that was before my time, but I do remember the upsets over UNC and Indiana."

Speaking of locals. Like you, was out on Friday for the afternoon games by the Garden grabbing drinks & food. I had my BC jacket on and grabbed a couple of seats by the bar. The group next to me (I'd say about 30 years old) proceeded to spend an hour just ripping BC everything from our travel rep to our irrelevancy, etc. I was tuning him out and we've talked about this before but why the fuck does everyone have a stick up their ass about BC around here?

[bignick33]

It amazes me that there are people who still look back fondly on JOB. As many of the posters here can tell you (because we were students), JOB was a terrible game coach. He developed some talent but not enough over 11 years. We were really bad at times. His record at BC and Ohio State without Scoonie Penn is below .500. He's scorched the earth at two schools and wasn't that great of a guy. If not for his buddy buddy relationship with the Boston media, he would have been killed for all he did and didn't do at BC.

People don't remember that he was an asshole and a cheater. They remember the excitement of the brand that was perceived to be of a very local nature.

[bignick33]

The other afternoon, I was having a beer at a bar in the financial district while watching the NCAA Tourney. I was wearing a BC polo because I was heading to the Garden for the BC/PC game later in the afternoon. A middle-aged suit who was drinking a glass of white wine at the bar asked me if I was a BC grad, then followed to comment to be "BC never should have fired O'Brien." Assuming that the comment was derived from recent Metro articles but not wanting to get too defensive, I somewhat flippantly replied "well, it's looking more and more like given the state of the program...it's too bad that the guy who followed him couldn't get along with the asshole AD as he had assembled a hell of a staff and was more successful in his two years than O'Brien ever was" or something along those lines. The suit replied "No, I was talking about Jimmy...they never should have canned him", to which I replied especially not wanting to bark down that tree, "that was before my time, but I do remember the upsets over UNC and Indiana."

Speaking of locals. Like you, was out on Friday for the afternoon games by the Garden grabbing drinks & food. I had my BC jacket on and grabbed a couple of seats by the bar. The group next to me (I'd say about 30 years old) proceeded to spend an hour just ripping BC everything from our travel rep to our irrelevancy, etc. I was tuning him out and we've talked about this before but why the fuck does everyone have a stick up their ass about BC around here?

Were they BU people? I'm actually of the belief that with the exception of people who are connected to a rival (BC, UMass, UConn, perhaps Holy Cross, etc), the perceived hatred of BC on the Boston area is overstated. At the risk of sounding creepy, whenever I'm at a place where there are a lot of kids/teenagers like a mall or a movie theater, I'm shocked by the number that are rocking BC gear. I think most of the animosity towards BC comes from people of a post-college age who have a specific reason to hate or be jealous of BC. Also, while I'm not doubting your example because I've experienced the same thing, I also feel that some BC fans are over-sensitive to this type of thing and tend to overreact when they hear this type of banter.

[claver2010]

Were they BU people? I'm actually of the belief that with the exception of people who are connected to a rival (BC, UMass, UConn, perhaps Holy Cross, etc), the perceived hatred of BC on the Boston area is overstated. At the risk of sounding creepy, whenever I'm at a place where there are a lot of kids/teenagers like a mall or a movie theater, I'm shocked by the number that are rocking BC gear. I think most of the animosity towards BC comes from people of a post-college age who have a specific reason to hate or be jealous of BC. Also, while I'm not doubting your example because I've experienced the same thing, I also feel that some BC fans are over-sensitive to this type of thing and tend to overreact when they hear this type of banter.

I believe they were UVM people (constantly talked about the UVM game)

Maybe the age demographic is a key point for me, since I'm around that "post-college age"

[eagle9903]

Were they BU people? I'm actually of the belief that with the exception of people who are connected to a rival (BC, UMass, UConn, perhaps Holy Cross, etc), the perceived hatred of BC on the Boston area is overstated. At the risk of sounding creepy, whenever I'm at a place where there are a lot of kids/teenagers like a mall or a movie theater, I'm shocked by the number that are rocking BC gear. I think most of the animosity towards BC comes from people of a post-college age who have a specific reason to hate or be jealous of BC. Also, while I'm not doubting your example because I've experienced the same thing, I also feel that some BC fans are over-sensitive to this type of thing and tend to overreact when they hear this type of banter.

I believe they were UVM people (constantly talked about the UVM game)

Maybe the age demographic is a key point for me, since I'm around that "post-college age"

aren't UVM people a bunch of filthy hippies? Or is this an incorrect assumption?