Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby HJS on Tue Dec 04, 2018 8:12 am

Good for Ryan Day. He is in for a handsome payday. But...

This is simply a terrible fit (something that ATL famously discusses as crucial for a coach's success). However, what I am specifically referring to is the terrible fans of a school like THE Ohio State who view their program as the professional sports team that makes the Bengals and Browns palatable. They are folks who believe that Beliceck should be taking over... but, if he passes, Sean McVay (the bloom is off the rose for Jon Gruden). Given Day's complete lack of ties to OSU or the midwest, they will have no qualms tossing him under the bus the second there is any cracks in the foundation.

From a football side, there will be a significant change in recruiting. OSU is loaded with kids from Florida and around the country. They passed up on every other program for the chance to play for Urban. For instance, the Bosa family is not sending their kids to Columbus to play for anyone other than Urban Meyer. That doesn't mean that focusing back on their midwest roots won't allow them to win big (see, Jim Tressel)... it just means that there will be a fundamental change in personnel.

OSU basically pays coordinators like BC pays head coaches. So... you will likely see HCRD able to hire a number of quality assistants. However, I am not so sure his bench is terribly deep. We all recall his previous lobbying efforts for guys like Devine.

Ultimately... you never want to be the guy to follow the Legend. OSU might have just set themselves up for what most coaches really want... to be the guy that follows the guy that followed the Legend.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby Cadillac90 on Tue Dec 04, 2018 8:14 am

HJS wrote:Good for Ryan Day. He is in for a handsome payday. But...

This is simply a terrible fit (something that ATL famously discusses as crucial for a coach's success). However, what I am specifically referring to is the terrible fans of a school like THE Ohio State who view their program as the professional sports team that makes the Bengals and Browns palatable. They are folks who believe that Beliceck should be taking over... but, if he passes, Sean McVay (the bloom is off the rose for Jon Gruden). Given Day's complete lack of ties to OSU or the midwest, they will have no qualms tossing him under the bus the second there is any cracks in the foundation.

From a football side, there will be a significant change in recruiting. OSU is loaded with kids from Florida and around the country. They passed up on every other program for the chance to play for Urban. For instance, the Bosa family is not sending their kids to Columbus to play for anyone other than Urban Meyer. That doesn't mean that focusing back on their midwest roots won't allow them to win big (see, Jim Tressel)... it just means that there will be a fundamental change in personnel.

OSU basically pays coordinators like BC pays head coaches. So... you will likely see HCRD able to hire a number of quality assistants. However, I am not so sure his bench is terribly deep. We all recall his previous lobbying efforts for guys like Devine.

Ultimately... you never want to be the guy to follow the Legend. OSU might have just set themselves up for what most coaches really want... to be the guy that follows the guy that followed the Legend.


How long before Day is sacked and Meyer is named head coach of FSU? 2 years?
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby TobaccoRoadEagle on Tue Dec 04, 2018 8:29 am

any chance he hires away t.s. slaughter as his offensive coordinator? if tosu really pays their assistants like head coaches and bc pays their head coaches like assistants, this seems like a perfect marriage to me.

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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby Tom Dooder on Tue Dec 04, 2018 8:30 am

Now we know why the Dazzler is still here. Jarmond clearly was working the Day lead until Meyer stepped down.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby hansen on Tue Dec 04, 2018 8:31 am

:81
Cadillac90 wrote:
HJS wrote:Good for Ryan Day. He is in for a handsome payday. But...

This is simply a terrible fit (something that ATL famously discusses as crucial for a coach's success). However, what I am specifically referring to is the terrible fans of a school like THE Ohio State who view their program as the professional sports team that makes the Bengals and Browns palatable. They are folks who believe that Beliceck should be taking over... but, if he passes, Sean McVay (the bloom is off the rose for Jon Gruden). Given Day's complete lack of ties to OSU or the midwest, they will have no qualms tossing him under the bus the second there is any cracks in the foundation.

From a football side, there will be a significant change in recruiting. OSU is loaded with kids from Florida and around the country. They passed up on every other program for the chance to play for Urban. For instance, the Bosa family is not sending their kids to Columbus to play for anyone other than Urban Meyer. That doesn't mean that focusing back on their midwest roots won't allow them to win big (see, Jim Tressel)... it just means that there will be a fundamental change in personnel.

OSU basically pays coordinators like BC pays head coaches. So... you will likely see HCRD able to hire a number of quality assistants. However, I am not so sure his bench is terribly deep. We all recall his previous lobbying efforts for guys like Devine.

Ultimately... you never want to be the guy to follow the Legend. OSU might have just set themselves up for what most coaches really want... to be the guy that follows the guy that followed the Legend.


How long before Day is sacked and hired by BC and then Meyer is named head coach of FSU ? 2 years?


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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby ATLeagle on Tue Dec 04, 2018 8:53 am

HJS is wrong again. Day will win a National Championship within three years at Ohio State.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby JesuitIvy on Tue Dec 04, 2018 8:56 am

Good for Ryan Day, how would you not take the gig, but real tough spot taking over for a successful coach like Meyer, no matter what the big name school. If I recall, the OSU fans never liked Tressel that much, and he won them an NC
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby commavegarage on Tue Dec 04, 2018 9:12 am

ATLeagle wrote:HJS is wrong again. Day will win a National Championship within three years at Ohio State.


i will absolutely take the other side of that bet

will be shocked if he isnt canned within 4 years
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby b0mberMan on Tue Dec 04, 2018 9:16 am

Feel like Day has more of a resume of accomplishments than Dabo did when he took over. Expectations couldn't be higher for a first time coach so should be fun.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby claver2010 on Tue Dec 04, 2018 9:17 am

Tom Dooder wrote:Now we know why the Dazzler is still here. Jarmond clearly was working the Day lead until Meyer stepped down.


i wouldn't be shocked at all if marty j reached out to his mentor and got the heads up of what was going to happen
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby ATLeagle on Tue Dec 04, 2018 9:20 am

claver2010 wrote:
Tom Dooder wrote:Now we know why the Dazzler is still here. Jarmond clearly was working the Day lead until Meyer stepped down.


i wouldn't be shocked at all if marty j reached out to his mentor and got the heads up of what was going to happen


Day, Meyer and Addazio all have the same agent. Hard to send out feelers in that situation.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby DomingoOrtiz on Tue Dec 04, 2018 9:23 am

b0mberMan wrote:Feel like Day has more of a resume of accomplishments than Dabo did when he took over. .


Easily, Dabo had never even been a coordinator.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby DavidGordonsFoot on Tue Dec 04, 2018 9:49 am

Has blogboy ejaculated, yet?
"I have history, and I understand history, so I know where we’ve been and where we are, and where we are trying to go, okay? But it’s been somewhere between 6.5 and 6.6 wins a year since 1980, which is 38 years. We’re at 7..."
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby hansen on Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:03 am

DavidGordonsFoot wrote:Has blogboy ejaculated, yet?


My first thought upon hearing this news was was that ATL must have such a freaking hardon right now.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby HJS on Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:03 am

ATLeagle wrote:HJS is wrong again. Day will win a National Championship within three years at Ohio State.

Well... he has Haskins for another year and has a team loaded with Top 5 recruiting classes. He isn't a bad coach and certainly has a chance to win a National Championship next year. But... that is much more a situation of Jags winning with Matt Ryan. The bet I'd take is that next season will be his high watermark. I also think there will be an immediate impact to recruiting (might not see it in the rankings as our former LB will be bumped to 5 stars... but will see it on the field). A note on Haskins... as great as he truly is... he represents the exact type of recruit who would not be in Columbus but for Urban Meyer (heck, he's not at OSU if HCRE doesn't get fired). No. Way. He's bypassing all other offers to go play for Ryan Day. Not yet at least. Maybe, in a bunch of years of Tressel-like performance, but not now.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby ATLeagle on Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:08 am

DavidGordonsFoot wrote:Has blogboy ejaculated, yet?


I am waiting for the Dinich interview with Day. That will be really special.

I am happy for him but frustrated that we never hired the best young coach in college football and he was on our staff three times for eight years and would have loved being here.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby eagletx on Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:15 am

TobaccoRoadEagle wrote:any chance he hires away t.s. slaughter as his offensive coordinator? if tosu really pays their assistants like head coaches and bc pays their head coaches like assistants, this seems like a perfect marriage to me.

foctosuhh


Figures I read recently (before Day's rumored bonus raise standing in for Meyer during his suspension) was Day was making $1M and Rutger's finest byproduct was making $1.5M. It was the one reason I thought that Day might have listened to Jarmond before it was clear that Meyer was leaving.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby claver2010 on Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:30 am

HJS wrote:
ATLeagle wrote:HJS is wrong again. Day will win a National Championship within three years at Ohio State.

Well... he has Haskins for another year and has a team loaded with Top 5 recruiting classes. He isn't a bad coach and certainly has a chance to win a National Championship next year. But... that is much more a situation of Jags winning with Matt Ryan. The bet I'd take is that next season will be his high watermark. I also think there will be an immediate impact to recruiting (might not see it in the rankings as our former LB will be bumped to 5 stars... but will see it on the field). A note on Haskins... as great as he truly is... he represents the exact type of recruit who would not be in Columbus but for Urban Meyer (heck, he's not at OSU if HCRE doesn't get fired). No. Way. He's bypassing all other offers to go play for Ryan Day. Not yet at least. Maybe, in a bunch of years of Tressel-like performance, but not now.


i'm sure someone will REFIRE this in a month or whatever but...

i wouldn't be surprised to see haskins declare. it's a very weak qb draft, esp if herbert stays at oregon as expected.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby RegalBCeagle on Tue Dec 04, 2018 11:49 am

ATLeagle wrote:HJS is wrong again. Day will win a National Championship within three years at Ohio State.


Ha ha. He may win one despite his coaching. The talent left behind by Meyer as well as the large amount of resources will allow him to have success. Don't let your desire to taste teh Day juice get in the way of the fact that he's a mediocre coach.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby HJS on Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:03 pm

claver2010 wrote:i wouldn't be surprised to see haskins declare. it's a very weak qb draft, esp if herbert stays at oregon as expected.

The Day promotion could be a Herzy-like promote Day or I leave thing.

From a business perspective, if Haskins can leave (I actually thought he couldn't leave until next year), he absolutely should. You are right, in that it is a weak QB class and he would be the premium play-caller. Next year, it will be a QB-rich class and he would be facing competition for Hebert and Tua. The only reason Haskins should think twice is because there isn't much QB need in the Top 10:
San Francisco 49ers (2-10) - Garappollo
Oakland Raiders (2-10) - Carr
New York Jets (3-9) - Darnold
Arizona Cardinals (3-9) - Rosen
Detroit Lions (4-8) - Stafford
Atlanta Falcons (4-8) - Ryan
New York Giants (4-8)
Buffalo Bills (4-8) - Allen
Jacksonville Jaguars (4-8)
Green Bay Packers (4-7-1)

Hard to imagine Haskins and Hebert making it past Giants, Jax and Packers. And, with Gruden's penchant for making bad trades to move down the Draft, teams like Cincy, Miami, Pitt, Washington or Tampa could easily move up. I'd also point out that this doesn't seem to be a great draft overall. A bunch of DLinemen, but not much else. Nick Bosa seems to be the only must-have. My point is that a team that is looking for a QB (now or in the near future) can surely take a shot on one this year without fear of missing out on much.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby flyingelvii on Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:11 pm

The Raiders are very much in need of a QB.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby twballgame9 on Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:26 pm

ATLeagle wrote:
DavidGordonsFoot wrote:Has blogboy ejaculated, yet?


I am waiting for the Dinich interview with Day. That will be really special.

I am happy for him but frustrated that we never hired the best young coach in college football and he was on our staff three times for eight years and would have loved being here.


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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby eagle33 on Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:32 pm

For some reason Umass hired FSU's OC Walt Bell to replace Whipple.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby MilitantEagle on Tue Dec 04, 2018 1:11 pm

HJS wrote:A note on Haskins... as great as he truly is... he represents the exact type of recruit who would not be in Columbus but for Urban Meyer (heck, he's not at OSU if HCRE doesn't get fired). No. Way.


Yes way

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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby gallopingghost on Tue Dec 04, 2018 3:20 pm

ATLeagle wrote:
DavidGordonsFoot wrote:Has blogboy ejaculated, yet?


I am waiting for the Dinich interview with Day. That will be really special.

I am happy for him but frustrated that we never hired the best young coach in college football and he was on our staff three times for eight years and would have loved being here.


Day was a terrible coach because 74, TRE and Teddy all said he sucked. What does Urban Meyer know compared to these brilliant football minds?
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby TobaccoRoadEagle on Tue Dec 04, 2018 3:35 pm

gallopingghost wrote:...What does Urban Meyer know compared to these brilliant football minds?


how to look the other way when an employee is repeatedly beating the shit out of their significant other.

meyer did have the heinz hammer as his offensive coordinator so he clearly understands how to assess football coaching abilities.

by the way, i think it was more mo'j than me that repeatedly said day sucked as a coach. i think my only comments about day revolve around him looking like a retarded asianed person

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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby claver2010 on Tue Dec 04, 2018 3:49 pm

i think moj's favorite target is don brown
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby TobaccoRoadEagle on Tue Dec 04, 2018 3:53 pm

claver2010 wrote:i think moj's favorite target is don brown

well, yeah - but mo'j has enough hate in him that he can hate on more than one coach. 3rd down donnie is at the top of his hit list but the retarded asiained dude is a close second

al golden is the only coach that i think mo'j likes and i have to assume that's because mo'j peed next to golden at some red bank bar and mo'j happened to get a view of the golden rod. he's been obsessed ever since
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby durkcal on Tue Dec 04, 2018 4:03 pm

There is recent success with hiring a young coach that has never been a head football coach at a football factory, even when replacing a strong coach - see Lincoln Riley (88% wp) and Kirby Smart (78% wp).


However, roughly 1/2 to 2/3 of the examples of prior to that - is not that good. The best proxies from the previous decade were Will Muschamp replacing Urban at Florida and Mark Helfrich replacing Chip Kelly at Oregon. Muschamp won 57% of his games, and Helfrich 70% of his games. Those are not win %'s that will allow Day to stay beyond 5 years.


For the sub 40 year olds that were hired in the past without HC experience, Bob Stoops, Dan Mullen at Miss State, Steve Sarkisian at UW, Bret Bielema at Wisconsin - barring Bielema who had 8-10 win expectations, they were replacing big losers. Even Dabo, hired at 40, replaced a coach with a WP% of 62%! Urban won 90% of his games at Ohio State! So, except the Bielema example - these are not in my mind comparable. And Bielema - was kind of encouraged to leave despite a 74% wp. He had a higher WP% than Alvarez, and Day will never be able to do that.

Age - guys like Jimbo Fisher at FSU and Chip Kelly at Oregon, Kyle Whittingham at Utah - they had more experience at the time of hire. They were 45/46. Ryan Day is 39. So these are possibly comparable, but I think the gravitas was much stronger.


Other young disappointments or at least in early days, w/o HC experience:
Bob Davie - 43 yrs old when hired at ND, 58% wp
Barry Odom - 40 yrs old at Missouri, 51% wp so far
Jeremy Pruitt - 44 yrs old at Tennessee, 42% wp so far, one season
Clay Helton - 44 at USC, 65% wp, but on HOT SEAT
Karl Dorrell - 40 at UCLA, 56% wp
Brad Scott - 40 at South Carolina, 42% wp
Bobby Williams - 41 at Michigan State, 48% wp

Successes:
Mark Richt - 41 yrs old at Georgia, 74% wp
Bo Pelini - 41 yrs old at Nebraska, 71% wp, but eventually fired
Phil Fulmer - 42 yrs old at Tennessee, 75% wp
Bill O'Brien - 43 yrs old at Penn State, 63% wp
Bielema - mentioned above


I'm sure there are a lot of other examples I didnt think of. How this one works out will be really interesting.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby HJS on Tue Dec 04, 2018 4:12 pm

TobaccoRoadEagle wrote:
claver2010 wrote:i think moj's favorite target is don brown

well, yeah - but mo'j has enough hate in him that he can hate on more than one coach. 3rd down donnie is at the top of his hit list but the retarded asiained dude is a close second

al golden is the only coach that i think mo'j likes and i have to assume that's because mo'j peed next to golden at some red bank bar and mo'j happened to get a view of the golden rod. he's been obsessed ever since

I actually was supportive of the work FHCRD did as OC. That said, I do admit that he couldn't score enough with Spaz's talent to make up for Third Down Donnie Brown's insistance to blitz everydown in spite of the fact that our DBs couldn't handle being on an island. I was not supportive of the only spawn of TOB/Jags/Spaz/Daz continuing those respective coaching trees at BC.

As for Golden... he may be taking the keys from the Patron Saint to the candy van. As for Golden, that fan fiction reads more like a flashback from an RBC dance.
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