Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby claver2010 on Sun Dec 05, 2021 6:39 pm

This Miami coach / AD search is some cluster, all good if Mario gets hired but if not….
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby twballgame9 on Sun Dec 05, 2021 9:29 pm

flyingelvii {l Wrote}:ND never legitimately challenged for a national title outside the year they played in the national title game and the other years he made the playoff. Giving yourself a lot of latitude with the word “legitimately”.


Lol they played in that game?

I am enjoying your diction critiques. Carry on.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby flyingelvii on Sun Dec 05, 2021 10:38 pm

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:
flyingelvii {l Wrote}:ND never legitimately challenged for a national title outside the year they played in the national title game and the other years he made the playoff. Giving yourself a lot of latitude with the word “legitimately”.


Lol they played in that game?

I am enjoying your diction critiques. Carry on.

As opposed to using an extremely narrow definition so you can fit your argument in. Otherwise it means there were like 3 teams that legitimately challenged for a title and didn’t win.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby eagle33 on Mon Dec 06, 2021 10:40 am

diaz out at miami. looks like the cristobal deal is done.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby Dick Rosenthal on Tue Dec 07, 2021 7:49 am

ATLeagle {l Wrote}:
Dick Rosenthal {l Wrote}:
HJS {l Wrote}:
b0mberMan {l Wrote}:Brent Venables getting talked up as the leader for the OU job. Would be tremendous to get him out of conference.

https://www.espn.com/college-football/s ... ball-coach
I can’t believe that Aranda did not get picked up this cycle based on the jobs that were open.


I don't know, if you watched the second half of Baylor-OK State yesterday, it was a master class in game management as taught by Steve Adazzio. Also, when you win the turnover battle +4, including three turnovers in or on the edges of the opponents Red Zone, it takes a special kind of ineptness to require your OLB to make a freakishly good play despite being lined up completely out of position to bring the opponent's running back down an inch shy of the goal line.


Dick:

Who are your Irish going to hire when they fire Freeman in three years?


I guess it depends on whether he emulates Ty Willy and spends three years playing golf and putting no effort into recruiting. I think the morons who tried to play the race card after they fired Ty Willy all had to drink a big frothy cup of STFU after he went to UDub and did the exact same thing and absolutely buried that program. The other failed coaches at ND who got their five year runs at least made an effort with respect to recruiting. Faust left Holtz a bundle of talent that formed the backbone of the 1988 National Championship (All Americans Frank Stams, Andy Heck, etc.), Davie left Ty Willie with enough talent that even a gross incompetent like Ty Willie could go 8-0 to start his ND career and was actually the architect of the class that signed in the wake of his firing (Quinn, Zibikowski, etc.) that Weis took and went 10-3 and 10-3 his first two years, and Weis left a plethora of talent that was then entire platform upon which Kelly made his run in 2012.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby OCs_Inner_Eagle on Tue Dec 07, 2021 8:48 am

Dick Rosenthal {l Wrote}:
ATLeagle {l Wrote}:
Dick Rosenthal {l Wrote}:
HJS {l Wrote}:
b0mberMan {l Wrote}:Brent Venables getting talked up as the leader for the OU job. Would be tremendous to get him out of conference.

https://www.espn.com/college-football/s ... ball-coach
I can’t believe that Aranda did not get picked up this cycle based on the jobs that were open.


I don't know, if you watched the second half of Baylor-OK State yesterday, it was a master class in game management as taught by Steve Adazzio. Also, when you win the turnover battle +4, including three turnovers in or on the edges of the opponents Red Zone, it takes a special kind of ineptness to require your OLB to make a freakishly good play despite being lined up completely out of position to bring the opponent's running back down an inch shy of the goal line.


Dick:

Who are your Irish going to hire when they fire Freeman in three years?


I guess it depends on whether he emulates Ty Willy and spends three years playing golf and putting no effort into recruiting. I think the morons who tried to play the race card after they fired Ty Willy all had to drink a big frothy cup of STFU after he went to UDub and did the exact same thing and absolutely buried that program. The other failed coaches at ND who got their five year runs at least made an effort with respect to recruiting. Faust left Holtz a bundle of talent that formed the backbone of the 1988 National Championship (All Americans Frank Stams, Andy Heck, etc.), Davie left Ty Willie with enough talent that even a gross incompetent like Ty Willie could go 8-0 to start his ND career and was actually the architect of the class that signed in the wake of his firing (Quinn, Zibikowski, etc.) that Weis took and went 10-3 and 10-3 his first two years, and Weis left a plethora of talent that was then entire platform upon which Kelly made his run in 2012.


Dick, you don't think the one thing Freeman will do above all else is recruit? He's known to be a tremendous recruiter, and like Hafley I imagine he will emphasize that going forward. ND should also be strong defensively given his expertise (yes, expertise) in that area. His risky move is keeping Rees as OC. He almost assuredly had to do so for his "stability" brand he sold to the ND administration. It probably also salvaged this year's class for the offensive side.

But Freeman better work on his internal ND political capital these months and keep a very close eye on Rees. We laugh about Funishment's anti-Hafley "God" kick, but that kind of performative thing actually matters at ND. In all seriousness, it would be a good move for Freeman to attend daily Mass. He might consider regular stops to the "Grotto".

But Freeman needs to kiss those rings. If he decides Rees will not build an offense that maximizes ND's ceiling, Freeman needs to have built the autonomy to push him out. That could be due to scheme or because he falls in love with lower-ceiling "try hard" QBs. Of course, that also holds if Rees simply tries to undermine Freeman.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby Dick Rosenthal on Tue Dec 07, 2021 11:16 am

I agree with all of what you said, and I was being sarcastic with respect to Blog Boy suggesting that Ty Willy got fired because of racism rather than being grossly incompetent and lazy with respect to recruiting. With respect to Freeman, I do think he will do exceptionally well as a recruiter--he already has, and with the dead weight of Kelly gone, I expect him to do even better.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby OCs_Inner_Eagle on Tue Dec 07, 2021 12:41 pm

Dick Rosenthal {l Wrote}:I agree with all of what you said, and I was being sarcastic with respect to Blog Boy suggesting that Ty Willy got fired because of racism rather than being grossly incompetent and lazy with respect to recruiting. With respect to Freeman, I do think he will do exceptionally well as a recruiter--he already has, and with the dead weight of Kelly gone, I expect him to do even better.


I usually have to home in on humor mode to pick up on some wisecracks and sarcasm--it doesn't come naturally. Agree Willingham's issue was more the poor recruiting, though I think ND was happy to check the "diversity" box and then quicker to recognize incompetence in Willingham than perhaps someone who knew how to kiss rings.

Davie was particularly good at the latter. I was around there in Holtz's last years and had read and heard accounts of how Davie cultivated the powers-that-be. Then one of my students told me a story about how he was bartending at the sports bar nearby and the coaching staff came in late one summer afternoon. Holtz was with them first and they just had food and soft drinks. Then Holtz left after maybe an hour to go home.

Of course at that point the coaches were going to go ahead and order beers and drinks. But it's one thing as an adult to just quietly put in your order for a beer or cocktail once the coach leaves. It's another to make a show of standing up and ordering pitchers for the table. That more overtly undermines Holtz as a fuddy-duddy who needs to get over himself. While all of that was true, it's not really that great for the "loyal" defensive coordinator to be the one doing so in front of the other subordinates.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby HJS on Tue Dec 07, 2021 2:58 pm

eagle33 {l Wrote}:diaz out at miami. looks like the cristobal deal is done.

https://www.espn.com/college-football/s ... canes-ills
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby HJS on Wed Dec 08, 2021 8:03 am

https://www.cbssports.com/college-footb ... cristobal/
Lots of big names have been tied to taking Phil Knight’s China-child-labor money. It has consistently been mentioned that Chip Kelly is being considered for a second act. That would open UCLA and allow Marty to bring in his guy.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby HJS on Wed Dec 08, 2021 10:59 pm

Tony Elliott favored for the UVA job.
https://www.espn.com/college-football/s ... ources-say

Pretty rough 2021 for Dabo. Since he’s more a cheerleader and recruiter, who he brings in to actually coach will determine the ongoing success.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby eepstein0 on Thu Dec 09, 2021 9:01 am

HJS {l Wrote}:Tony Elliott favored for the UVA job.
https://www.espn.com/college-football/s ... ources-say

Pretty rough 2021 for Dabo. Since he’s more a cheerleader and recruiter, who he brings in to actually coach will determine the ongoing success.


Clemson is in major trouble without those recruiters.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby claver2010 on Fri Dec 10, 2021 2:57 pm

HJS {l Wrote}:Tony Elliott favored for the UVA job.
https://www.espn.com/college-football/s ... ources-say

Pretty rough 2021 for Dabo. Since he’s more a cheerleader and recruiter, who he brings in to actually coach will determine the ongoing success.


Confirmed!

interesting to see how dabo reloads
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby twballgame9 on Fri Dec 10, 2021 11:15 pm

flyingelvii {l Wrote}:
twballgame9 {l Wrote}:
flyingelvii {l Wrote}:ND never legitimately challenged for a national title outside the year they played in the national title game and the other years he made the playoff. Giving yourself a lot of latitude with the word “legitimately”.


Lol they played in that game?

I am enjoying your diction critiques. Carry on.

As opposed to using an extremely narrow definition so you can fit your argument in. Otherwise it means there were like 3 teams that legitimately challenged for a title and didn’t win.


"Legitimately challenged" is a good description for that ND team.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby twballgame9 on Fri Dec 10, 2021 11:17 pm

Eddie Lacy just scored again.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby HJS on Sat Dec 11, 2021 12:00 am

Duke made a pretty nice hire in Mike Elko.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby flyingelvii on Sat Dec 11, 2021 1:01 am

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:
flyingelvii {l Wrote}:
twballgame9 {l Wrote}:
flyingelvii {l Wrote}:ND never legitimately challenged for a national title outside the year they played in the national title game and the other years he made the playoff. Giving yourself a lot of latitude with the word “legitimately”.


Lol they played in that game?

I am enjoying your diction critiques. Carry on.

As opposed to using an extremely narrow definition so you can fit your argument in. Otherwise it means there were like 3 teams that legitimately challenged for a title and didn’t win.


"Legitimately challenged" is a good description for that ND team.

I agree that teams should not strive to make the National Championship game for fear of losing in it.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby twballgame9 on Sat Dec 11, 2021 7:29 am

flyingelvii {l Wrote}:
twballgame9 {l Wrote}:
flyingelvii {l Wrote}:
twballgame9 {l Wrote}:
flyingelvii {l Wrote}:ND never legitimately challenged for a national title outside the year they played in the national title game and the other years he made the playoff. Giving yourself a lot of latitude with the word “legitimately”.


Lol they played in that game?

I am enjoying your diction critiques. Carry on.

As opposed to using an extremely narrow definition so you can fit your argument in. Otherwise it means there were like 3 teams that legitimately challenged for a title and didn’t win.


"Legitimately challenged" is a good description for that ND team.

I agree that teams should not strive to make the National Championship game for fear of losing in it.


Ironic strawman. Well played.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby ATLeagle on Sat Dec 11, 2021 8:06 am

HJS {l Wrote}:Duke made a pretty nice hire in Mike Elko.


I think Duke will always be a tough job because they don't care about Football. It will also be interesting to see what happens after Coach K leaves. They might stop caring about revenue sports in general.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby HJS on Sat Dec 11, 2021 10:20 am

ATLeagle {l Wrote}:
HJS {l Wrote}:Duke made a pretty nice hire in Mike Elko.


I think Duke will always be a tough job because they don't care about Football. It will also be interesting to see what happens after Coach K leaves. They might stop caring about revenue sports in general.

So, as BC strives to be like Duke academically, Duke strives to be like BC athletically.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby Dick Rosenthal on Sat Dec 11, 2021 9:33 pm

Between Lea ending up back at Vandy and now Elko landing at Duke, It is clear that Freeman is the only Brian Kelly DC who was thinking clearly about the long game.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby flyingelvii on Sat Dec 11, 2021 9:52 pm

He got paid and got lucky. Like 8 things had to happen for him to get the ND position starting with him choosing ND over LSU, Cincy making the playoffs to take Fickell off the market, Coach O pissing off boosters two years after a National Championship, Lincoln Riley choosing USC, and I’m sure others. Better to be lucky than good.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby Dick Rosenthal on Sun Dec 12, 2021 10:57 am

flyingelvii {l Wrote}:He got paid and got lucky. Like 8 things had to happen for him to get the ND position starting with him choosing ND over LSU, Cincy making the playoffs to take Fickell off the market, Coach O pissing off boosters two years after a National Championship, Lincoln Riley choosing USC, and I’m sure others. Better to be lucky than good.


Yes, a lot of luck involved, but the fact that he took ND over LSU showed some awareness. Elko did not have that sort of awareness when he took the money and jumped ship to A&M, which did nothing but hurt his reputation as a defensive genius--especially when coupled with the fact that Lea came in and the defense outperformed what it did under Elko (more as a result of improved recruiting that anything Lea did, but it didn't help). Lea's decision is even more baffling. I know he is an alum, but Vandy is where promising coaches go to kill their careers. Yes, Franklin did well by Vandy standards (6-7, 9-4, 8-4) but benefitted from a few very unique historical anomalies within the SEC all happening at the same time (specifically Ole Miss, Tennessee, Florida and Kentucky being bad beyond any historical norms all at the same time). Lea should have avoided that job like the plague and banked the current 11-1 season. While he admittedly would have been clairvoyant to see Kelly being lured away by LSU, I am guessing that Lea would have been a top candidate for the ND job had he still been there and at the very least would have been a candidate for some of the better available jobs that opened this year.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby HJS on Sun Dec 12, 2021 12:19 pm

Dick Rosenthal {l Wrote}:
flyingelvii {l Wrote}:He got paid and got lucky. Like 8 things had to happen for him to get the ND position starting with him choosing ND over LSU, Cincy making the playoffs to take Fickell off the market, Coach O pissing off boosters two years after a National Championship, Lincoln Riley choosing USC, and I’m sure others. Better to be lucky than good.


Yes, a lot of luck involved, but the fact that he took ND over LSU showed some awareness. Elko did not have that sort of awareness when he took the money and jumped ship to A&M, which did nothing but hurt his reputation as a defensive genius--especially when coupled with the fact that Lea came in and the defense outperformed what it did under Elko (more as a result of improved recruiting that anything Lea did, but it didn't help). Lea's decision is even more baffling. I know he is an alum, but Vandy is where promising coaches go to kill their careers. Yes, Franklin did well by Vandy standards (6-7, 9-4, 8-4) but benefitted from a few very unique historical anomalies within the SEC all happening at the same time (specifically Ole Miss, Tennessee, Florida and Kentucky being bad beyond any historical norms all at the same time). Lea should have avoided that job like the plague and banked the current 11-1 season. While he admittedly would have been clairvoyant to see Kelly being lured away by LSU, I am guessing that Lea would have been a top candidate for the ND job had he still been there and at the very least would have been a candidate for some of the better available jobs that opened this year.

Nothing in this explanation is an argument that speaks to Freeman being anything other than lucky.

After multiple years, Elko leaves for more money... defense was just as good under Lea... which proves it was really about talent and not coaching ability of either coach...
After multiple years, Lea leaves for more money... defense wasn't as good under Freeman... which proves it was really about talent and not coaching ability of either coach...
After a few months, Freeman is rewarded as head coach based on his brilliant career move of not leaving for another job during the season.

I'd note that, during the season, Domers were happy about Freeman's recruiting... less so his coaching. Started the year giving up a ton of points to the likes of FSU, Toledo, VT and UNC. Combine that with a Cincy loss, plenty ND alums were underwhelmed. But, ND ended the year with the gauntlet of QB-less teams in USNA, UVA, GT and Stanford. Freeman's D inflated season stats by surrendering a mere combined 23 points. Huzzah!!! No-brainer hire! JurkWatch forever, Tommy Rees never!
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby TontoKowalski on Sun Dec 12, 2021 1:58 pm

Bob Diaco was an ND defensive coordinator.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby ATLeagle on Sun Dec 12, 2021 5:16 pm

In the current format ND has a pretty good lane to the playoff annually. If it goes to an 8 or 12 team format, they will be locks. That will give recruiting some perpetual motion. Then it is on Freeman to staff well and manage games when things get tight.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby HJS on Sun Dec 12, 2021 8:23 pm

ATLeagle {l Wrote}:In the current format ND has a pretty good lane to the playoff annually. If it goes to an 8 or 12 team format, they will be locks. That will give recruiting some perpetual motion. Then it is on Freeman to staff well and manage games when things get tight.

The whole P12, ACC, B10 alliance was essentially formed to prevent the playoff proposal of B12, ND, SEC.
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby claver2010 on Sun Dec 12, 2021 10:08 pm

Yeah but in its current state the pac has been shut out for half a decade and SEC is 50% of the field

It’s going to go to 12, it’s just a matter of when the non sec conferences get over Texas and OU leaving
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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby eagle33 on Mon Dec 13, 2021 8:52 am

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Re: Coaching Carousel/Candidates Mega Thread

Postby TobaccoRoadEagle on Mon Dec 13, 2021 8:59 am

that has the distinct smell of #beadude vines but might be even cringier
now in the street there is violence
and, and a lots of work to be done
no place to hang out our washing
and, and i can't blame all on the sun
good god we gonna rock down to electric avenue
and then we'll take it higher
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