Flutie or Smith?

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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby QuailMan on Sat Sep 19, 2015 5:06 am

StratEagle {l Wrote}:The safety, the incredibly unlucky bounce on the muff which would have been a TD, the uncalled facemask on the Hilliman fumble...

FSU's offense had nothing, and honestly we left like 5 sacks out there tonight. That game was very winnable, you're nuts.


Was it a game we could have easily won or a very winnable game? Make up your mind. It was a winnable game if the offense could even get into the redzone
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby StratEagle on Sat Sep 19, 2015 5:10 am

QuailMan {l Wrote}:
StratEagle {l Wrote}:The safety, the incredibly unlucky bounce on the muff which would have been a TD, the uncalled facemask on the Hilliman fumble...

FSU's offense had nothing, and honestly we left like 5 sacks out there tonight. That game was very winnable, you're nuts.


Was it a game we could have easily won or a very winnable game? Make up your mind. It was a winnable game if the offense could even get into the redzone

I was not saying it would have been an easy victory. Could have easily won was obviously meant to imply that it was very winnable.

"A level" interpretation
Last edited by StratEagle on Sat Sep 19, 2015 5:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby QuailMan on Sat Sep 19, 2015 5:11 am

StratEagle {l Wrote}:
QuailMan {l Wrote}:
StratEagle {l Wrote}:The safety, the incredibly unlucky bounce on the muff which would have been a TD, the uncalled facemask on the Hilliman fumble...

FSU's offense had nothing, and honestly we left like 5 sacks out there tonight. That game was very winnable, you're nuts.


Was it a game we could have easily won or a very winnable game? Make up your mind. It was a winnable game if the offense could even get into the redzone

I was not saying it would have been an easy victory. Could have easily won was obviously meant to imply that it was very winnable.

A level interpretation


The interpretation does not matter. No game is winnable when you don't score.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby HJS on Sat Sep 19, 2015 6:02 am

StratEagle {l Wrote}:The safety, the incredibly unlucky bounce on the muff which would have been a TD, the SC transfer stone hands play, the uncalled facemask on the Hilliman fumble...

FSU's offense had nothing, and honestly we left like 5 sacks out there tonight. That game was very winnable, you're nuts.

BC's Gameplan was to get it to the 4th Q within a score. They did that even without a single break. Every bounce went FSU's way: safety, recovered muffed punt, the punt rolling to the 1, the barely missed hitting the FSU player punt. Let me also point our that the ACC refs were apparently told never to call penalties on FSU. Probably the least penalized game that team plays this year. Nonetheless, there they were. Moving the ball in the 4th when Hilliman fumbled. That's why Dazoo was so pissed and basically through Hilliman under the bus after the game.

Wade did what was asked. He managed the game and didn't make mistakes. Rouse can't play against teams like that and we wasted downs accordingly. Nonetheless... Smith is the answer as the only person on the team who can throw the ball is done for the year.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby QuailMan on Sat Sep 19, 2015 6:14 am

You're describing a game where everything would have had to gone absolutely perfect for us to win. BC did get breaks, FSU missed a FG that their kicker makes 90% of the time and lost their best play maker for most of the 2nd half. If that was really our game plan then daz isn't even a b list coach
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby HJS on Sat Sep 19, 2015 6:18 am

No. I'm describing the game that actually happened last night.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby eagle9903 on Sat Sep 19, 2015 6:20 am

I think smith is viewed with wayyyy too much optimism. I hope I'm wrong and he's certainly elusive but I have a hard time seeing him jump in quickly.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby HJS on Sat Sep 19, 2015 6:30 am

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:I think smith is viewed with wayyyy too much optimism. I hope I'm wrong and he's certainly elusive but I have a hard time seeing him jump in quickly.

I don't think it is as much optimism as it is certainty in Smith being the best option given the alternative. This isn't a debate of Smith or a healthy Wade. This is Smith vs. making Wade play on crutches.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby MilitantEagle on Sat Sep 19, 2015 6:42 am

Can one of the recruiting weirdos tell me whether Jeff Smith's other P5 offers - supposedly Louisville, Wisconsin and Indiana (others?) - were for QB or ATH?
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby TobaccoRoadEagle on Sat Sep 19, 2015 7:23 am

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:I think smith is viewed with wayyyy too much optimism. I hope I'm wrong and he's certainly elusive but I have a hard time seeing him jump in quickly.

what are you, new here? the unknown is ALWAYS better than the known. no one could be worse than al skinner.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby eagle9903 on Sat Sep 19, 2015 7:31 am

HJS {l Wrote}:
eagle9903 {l Wrote}:I think smith is viewed with wayyyy too much optimism. I hope I'm wrong and he's certainly elusive but I have a hard time seeing him jump in quickly.

I don't think it is as much optimism as it is certainty in Smith being the best option given the alternative. This isn't a debate of Smith or a healthy Wade. This is Smith vs. making Wade play on crutches.


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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby rktbrkr on Sat Sep 19, 2015 8:02 am

Both Smith and Flutie are 180lbs so they won't be able to take all the pounding of FT QB esp Smith as a run first QB. Nosovitch might be the only guy on the roster who could be a run/pass mix.

Wade injury was really unfortunate for him personally and a big setback for the team. This is where Daz gets to prove his mettle if he can cobble together a semi OK offense.

I thought OL looked OK considering the level of opposition, much better than the ME game, relatively speaking. I couldn't watch more than a few mins of the Howard game.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby BrightonEagle on Sat Sep 19, 2015 8:05 am

for this offense, smith. it's not because i necessarily think he's a better qb in general, but because, with our wrs and our pass blocking, i think the only way we're going to be successful is to go to last year's offense and run the qb a lot. i might even say smith over a healthy wade for that reason. wade looks like a good passer, but our offense/personnel just doesn't fit him and wasn't doing him any favors.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby EagleNYC on Sat Sep 19, 2015 8:27 am

I agree with the general consensus that Smith has the higher ceiling. But he' sheen on campus for only a few months. How well does he know the playbook? That's not a knock on him, most kids are still figuring out the Newton shuttle at this point. It's easy to see his speed and say "just run the Murphy offense", but this kid has to run the team. I think that the kid has great speed and want to believe that he'll add some life to a listless offense. But with our OL, I'm not sure he'll last the full season.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby eepstein0 on Sat Sep 19, 2015 9:04 am

MilitantEagle {l Wrote}:Can one of the recruiting weirdos tell me whether Jeff Smith's other P5 offers - supposedly Louisville, Wisconsin and Indiana (others?) - were for QB or ATH?


Ohio St came in late.

Smith can throw the ball plenty well, the question is the playbook. Watch his recruiting highlights he has a cannon
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby twballgame9 on Sat Sep 19, 2015 9:25 am

QuailMan {l Wrote}:
StratEagle {l Wrote}:
QuailMan {l Wrote}:
StratEagle {l Wrote}:We could have easily beaten the number 9 team in the country had a few plays went our way. They got about every single break in the entire game. The team will be better with Jeff Smith. The sky isn't falling. Still an 7-8 win team.

This defense will be unreal next year and the year after.


We didn't score

And we held an extremely talented team to 7 points and a lucky fumble return. The offense can only go up from here (cue the Crane joke). Smiths legs will provide an instant upgrade. My only worry is that kid looks frail so he may not last.


What plays did we miss that would've helped us easily win? The safety? We wouldn't have won scoring two points


We aren't playing FSU all season. Just like we aren't going to drop 76 every game because we aren't playing Howard all season.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby durkcal on Sat Sep 19, 2015 9:49 am

It is going to be a combo of both, at least to begin with. They clearly believe Flutie is the better thrower at this point. J Smith has the legs that they will bring in for that purpose. If the offense looks demonstrably less terrible with one versus the other, they may eventually shift to a 100% starter.

If our offensive coaching does not improve in a hurry, we are in trouble. Don Brown looks good right now because players like Landry and Kam Moore have come so far so fast. Northern Illinois is capable of beating us. (Hope I am wrong about that) Fitch , Frye and Daz seem to only be able to develop and work with multi-year starters that are Seniors.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby twballgame9 on Sat Sep 19, 2015 9:56 am

durkcal {l Wrote}:It is going to be a combo of both, at least to begin with. They clearly believe Flutie is the better thrower at this point. J Smith has the legs that they will bring in for that purpose. If the offense looks demonstrably less terrible with one versus the other, they may eventually shift to a 100% starter.

If our offensive coaching does not improve in a hurry, we are in trouble. Don Brown looks good right now because players like Landry and Kam Moore have come so far so fast. Northern Illinois is capable of beating us. (Hope I am wrong about that) Fitch , Frye and Daz seem to only be able to develop and work with multi-year starters that are Seniors.



Flutie can't throw at all. Smith has a better arm. No idea why they are pretending this is a tough call. Maybe because he is a true frosh and doesn't know as many plays. Only explanation.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby claver2010 on Sat Sep 19, 2015 10:01 am

Even if Flutie can throw, the WRs can't get separation and the OL can't pass block sooooo......
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby twballgame9 on Sat Sep 19, 2015 10:12 am

Can someone explain why Flutie didn't pitch the ball?
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby DuxEagle26 on Sat Sep 19, 2015 10:17 am

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:
Flutie can't throw at all. Smith has a better arm. No idea why they are pretending this is a tough call.


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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby flakes on Sat Sep 19, 2015 10:25 am

DuxEagle26 {l Wrote}:
twballgame9 {l Wrote}:
Flutie can't throw at all. Smith has a better arm. No idea why they are pretending this is a tough call.


THIS


Flutie looks like he can't even fully grip the ball with one hand. Show me one throw that Wade completed last night that Smith doesn't have the ability to make. He looks like the fastest guy on our roster too. I feel bad for Wade, but he should have been starting day one.

On defense though, I have never seen a BC D flying to the ball like that, even in the Herzy years. The young guys have some serious swag…Moore, Yiadom etc. Not to to mention Landry who is a complete fucking madman.

Then there's this
http://screengrabber.deadspin.com/i-thi ... 1731789908
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby maxwell22 on Sat Sep 19, 2015 10:28 am

This team is "run first" for a very good reason; they can't pass!
They don't have a QB that can really throw . . . for the 2nd year in a row.
They also lack a real deep threat wideout and have an extremely inexperienced OL.
Too bad . . . because this about the best defense that BC has had in years
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby twballgame9 on Sat Sep 19, 2015 10:45 am

Wade throws fine. No QB is throwing behind this line.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby HJS on Sat Sep 19, 2015 11:04 am

Can we please just fucking stop with the play calling comments. It is beyond retarded and is simply the lowest form of Monday morning quarterbacking. "We can't win because we can't score because of the play calling." Yet just last fucking week won by scoring 76 points with the same people calling plays. Just fucking idiotic. Discuss strategy, personnel decisions, player performance and even specific plays at key points in the game. But generic play calling gripes is no different than writing "We aren't winning games that we lose."
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby BrightonEagle on Sat Sep 19, 2015 11:08 am

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:Wade throws fine. No QB is throwing behind this line.

agreed, and i'd add with these receivers. we should go with smith because he's the better runner.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby flakes on Sat Sep 19, 2015 11:08 am

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:Wade throws fine. No QB is throwing behind this line.


Yes, Wade throws fine…better than fine…but because we have no WRs (and therefore quite obviously a minimal passing playbook) Smith is clearly the best option. I don't think the line was THAT bad last night.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby dtwalrus on Sat Sep 19, 2015 11:16 am

EagleNYC {l Wrote}:I agree with the general consensus that Smith has the higher ceiling. But he' sheen on campus for only a few months. How well does he know the playbook? That's not a knock on him, most kids are still figuring out the Newton shuttle at this point. It's easy to see his speed and say "just run the Murphy offense", but this kid has to run the team. I think that the kid has great speed and want to believe that he'll add some life to a listless offense. But with our OL, I'm not sure he'll last the full season.


This. When Smith came in last night he didn't know the play book. Smith had a 3rd and 2 on his first drive last night and BC had to take a time out with 8 minutes left to avoid a delay of game. What you might not have seen on TV, but everyone in the stadium witnessed was Smith literally shrugging his shoulders as the play was called in from the side line. He had no idea what play the coaches wanted to run. By the time he got it, or they switched to something he did know, it was too late.

My guess, that was probably a big part of why he was pulled and Flutie finished the game.

Daz is always talking about the QB needing to first and foremost, "manage the game." I expect Flutie to start next week.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby BCMurt09 on Sat Sep 19, 2015 11:31 am

Thamel is already implying Smith will start next week but it sounds like that is purely based off the depth chart. I anticipate them to start Smith and dumb down the playbook for the next few weeks until he can learn more of the plays. There is still a very long season ahead of us and plenty of opportunity to get to a bowl game.

These next three weeks are key. Anything less than 2-1 (really 3-0) and we could be in trouble. The defense can win these games, we just need the offense to be good enough.
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Re: Flutie or Smith?

Postby footer20 on Sat Sep 19, 2015 11:56 am

When it comes to playcalling, I don't think anyone here is saying that that is why we lost.

What people are upset with, is that the play calling was rarely innovative. When you are seriously outmatched, you can't just stick with the halfback dives and play action passes on third down.You need to get creative. We didn't even attempt to until the drive that resulted in the Hilliman fumble (which was the most vanilla 2nd and 12 play call ever).

The play calling isn't why we didn't score, but it sure is frustrating to watch us try the same run-run-pass-punt shit when it's obviously not working.
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