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TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:yeah - all those shitty miami, west virginia and vpi teams that we faced year after year (well before your visions of colby started dancing in your head)

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:yeah - all those shitty miami, west virginia and vpi teams that we faced year after year (well before your visions of colby started dancing in your head)

I'll give you two teams. Wvu was at best mediocre from 1994-2004, and BC joined the ACC the year they got good.

TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:yeah - all those shitty miami, west virginia and vpi teams that we faced year after year (well before your visions of colby started dancing in your head)

I'll give you two teams. Wvu was at best mediocre from 1994-2004, and BC joined the ACC the year they got good.

mediocre or not, they frikken owned bc and won all but 3 of the games played in your outlined 11 years

cuse would have been a better name to drop, and not just for the diamond ferri bowl

TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:yeah - all those shitty miami, west virginia and vpi teams that we faced year after year (well before your visions of colby started dancing in your head)

I'll give you two teams. Wvu was at best mediocre from 1994-2004, and BC joined the ACC the year they got good.

mediocre or not, they frikken owned bc and won all but 3 of the games played in your outlined 11 years

cuse would have been a better name to drop, and not just for the diamond ferri bowl

innocentbystander {l Wrote}:

TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:yeah - all those shitty miami, west virginia and vpi teams that we faced year after year (well before your visions of colby started dancing in your head)

I'll give you two teams. Wvu was at best mediocre from 1994-2004, and BC joined the ACC the year they got good.

mediocre or not, they frikken owned bc and won all but 3 of the games played in your outlined 11 years

cuse would have been a better name to drop, and not just for the diamond ferri bowl

ah, yup

The Friday night of my 5 year high school reunion, day after Thanksgiving actually, I remember getting dressed while watching BC (who had just ended Notre Dame national championship hopes) losing (at home) to a then 10-0 WVa team. Of course, this is the year before Theodore's little 11 year window. But as far as I can remember, the moonshine drinkers have always been at least decent on the field....

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

innocentbystander {l Wrote}:

TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:yeah - all those shitty miami, west virginia and vpi teams that we faced year after year (well before your visions of colby started dancing in your head)

I'll give you two teams. Wvu was at best mediocre from 1994-2004, and BC joined the ACC the year they got good.

mediocre or not, they frikken owned bc and won all but 3 of the games played in your outlined 11 years

cuse would have been a better name to drop, and not just for the diamond ferri bowl

ah, yup

The Friday night of my 5 year high school reunion, day after Thanksgiving actually, I remember getting dressed while watching BC (who had just ended Notre Dame national championship hopes) losing (at home) to a then 10-0 WVa team. Of course, this is the year before Theodore's little 11 year window. But as far as I can remember, the moonshine drinkers have always been at least decent on the field....

My "little 11 year window" covered the years TOB played them dipshit. And I went back two years before because they were mediocre then too. Rutgers invented football, does that make them awesome in the late 90s?

TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

innocentbystander {l Wrote}:

TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:yeah - all those shitty miami, west virginia and vpi teams that we faced year after year (well before your visions of colby started dancing in your head)

I'll give you two teams. Wvu was at best mediocre from 1994-2004, and BC joined the ACC the year they got good.

mediocre or not, they frikken owned bc and won all but 3 of the games played in your outlined 11 years

cuse would have been a better name to drop, and not just for the diamond ferri bowl

ah, yup

The Friday night of my 5 year high school reunion, day after Thanksgiving actually, I remember getting dressed while watching BC (who had just ended Notre Dame national championship hopes) losing (at home) to a then 10-0 WVa team. Of course, this is the year before Theodore's little 11 year window. But as far as I can remember, the moonshine drinkers have always been at least decent on the field....

My "little 11 year window" covered the years TOB played them dipshit. And I went back two years before because they were mediocre then too. Rutgers invented football, does that make them awesome in the late 90s?

going back to 94 picks up some henning years, doesn't it?

doesn't change the argument you are making... just finding a strawman to help nospace continue his abuse of you

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

Eaglekeeper {l Wrote}:TOB won an average of 8 games every year, had attendance over 40,000, very few off field player issues, sent his own kid to Xaverian, conducted himself with class and represented the values and culture of BC very well. He was not a terrific coach like TC, but BC has zero interest in building a top 15 program anyway, thus TOB was a perfect fit for BC. A billboard sign in the stadium of TOB with the caption "Miss Me Yet" would be appropriate!

TOB did that in a shitty conference. He also was an asshole... He also hated BC.

TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:

TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:yeah - all those shitty miami, west virginia and vpi teams that we faced year after year (well before your visions of colby started dancing in your head)

I'll give you two teams. Wvu was at best mediocre from 1994-2004, and BC joined the ACC the year they got good.

mediocre or not, they frikken owned bc and won all but 3 of the games played in your outlined 11 years

cuse would have been a better name to drop, and not just for the diamond ferri bowl

TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:yeah - all those shitty miami, west virginia and vpi teams that we faced year after year (well before your visions of colby started dancing in your head)

eepstein0 {l Wrote}:

TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:yeah - all those shitty miami, west virginia and vpi teams that we faced year after year (well before your visions of colby started dancing in your head)

I've also been going to BC Football games since I was 9 months old so spare me the above bullshit.

Those conferences absolutely blew back then.

Eaglekeeper {l Wrote}:TOB loved BC, he hated GDF. TOB was at the Frozen 4 last year, he is a good friend of JY.

hansen {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:TOB did that in a shitty conference. He also was an asshole... He also hated BC.

this reason is the tiebreaker that makes me go Daz >:Toby > Spaz

HJS {l Wrote}:

hansen {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:TOB did that in a shitty conference. He also was an asshole... He also hated BC.

this reason is the tiebreaker that makes me go Daz >:Toby > Spaz

I was probably one of the first to be done with Toby (probably the case with every coach not named Jags or Skinner). That said, I think I'd put TOB ahead of Daz because he had a much more stable program by Year 4. He also was crushing it year-over-year in recruiting. They both had their maddeningly weird turtle-up situations and WTF losses due to ultra-conservative gameplans. But, Daz stands alone... even behind Spaz... in worst in-game coaching. So, I'd rank them...

Jags>TOB>Daz>Henning>Spaz

HJS {l Wrote}:

hansen {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:TOB did that in a shitty conference. He also was an asshole... He also hated BC.

this reason is the tiebreaker that makes me go Daz >:Toby > Spaz

I was probably one of the first to be done with Toby (probably the case with every coach not named Jags or Skinner). That said, I think I'd put TOB ahead of Daz because he had a much more stable program by Year 4. He also was crushing it year-over-year in recruiting. They both had their maddeningly weird turtle-up situations and WTF losses due to ultra-conservative gameplans. But, Daz stands alone... even behind Spaz... in worst in-game coaching. So, I'd rank them...

Jags>TOB>Daz>Henning>Spaz

innocentbystander {l Wrote}:

HJS {l Wrote}:

hansen {l Wrote}:

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:TOB did that in a shitty conference. He also was an asshole... He also hated BC.

this reason is the tiebreaker that makes me go Daz >:Toby > Spaz

I was probably one of the first to be done with Toby (probably the case with every coach not named Jags or Skinner). That said, I think I'd put TOB ahead of Daz because he had a much more stable program by Year 4. He also was crushing it year-over-year in recruiting. They both had their maddeningly weird turtle-up situations and WTF losses due to ultra-conservative gameplans. But, Daz stands alone... even behind Spaz... in worst in-game coaching. So, I'd rank them...

Jags>TOB>Daz>Henning>Spaz

Agree with all of this, +5 for HJS

Eaglekeeper {l Wrote}:I would not rank Jags ahead of TOB, he personally cost us the ACCCG with no running game and horrible clock management. He almost cost us the MSU bowl game as well. He inherited TOB's talent and as for WTF losses, how about the Maryland game? Jags is so overrated by this board. The program was trending down under his watch, he was doing zero recruiting. It's no surprise no other school wanted him either.

Eaglekeeper {l Wrote}:I would not rank Jags ahead of TOB, he personally cost us the ACCCG with no running game and horrible clock management. He almost cost us the MSU bowl game as well. He inherited TOB's talent and as for WTF losses, how about the Maryland game? Jags is so overrated by this board. The program was trending down under his watch, he was doing zero recruiting. It's no surprise no other school wanted him either.

eepstein0 {l Wrote}:TOB in the current ACC would spin out shitty 6-6 season one after another.

The ACC is ridiculous and the Big East back then was a joke more or less

jhiggi02 {l Wrote}:The only coach I have watched at BC that I would prefer Daz over would be Spaz.

I do remember all the boring offenses and WTF losses of the TOB era. They were extremely frustrating, the team often felt like it was on the cusp of breaking through but never really achieved anything of note and most of that blame is on TOB's shoulders. But that is a major difference between TOB and Daz, Daz will never have the team on the precipice of going from 8 to 10 wins. And although neither are ideal coaches, TOB developed talent, found QBs and Olinemen, and consistently won 8-9 games, things that are only a dream for the current Bad Hombre in charge. From an off field perspective, both suck but I would still prefer TOB. Daz' excuses have grown old and his lack of production combined with the aforementioned cowardliness of blaming 18 year old freshman for his mistakes makes his whole Be A Dude act hypocritical at best.


At least with TOB, there was hope heading into the season, the same can't be said with Daz

dtwalrus {l Wrote}:
Both TOB and Daz won 23 games their first 4 seasons, an average of 5.75 wins per season each.

jhiggi02 {l Wrote}:

dtwalrus {l Wrote}:

jhiggi02 {l Wrote}:The only coach I have watched at BC that I would prefer Daz over would be Spaz.

I do remember all the boring offenses and WTF losses of the TOB era. They were extremely frustrating, the team often felt like it was on the cusp of breaking through but never really achieved anything of note and most of that blame is on TOB's shoulders. But that is a major difference between TOB and Daz, Daz will never have the team on the precipice of going from 8 to 10 wins. And although neither are ideal coaches, TOB developed talent, found QBs and Olinemen, and consistently won 8-9 games, things that are only a dream for the current Bad Hombre in charge. From an off field perspective, both suck but I would still prefer TOB. Daz' excuses have grown old and his lack of production combined with the aforementioned cowardliness of blaming 18 year old freshman for his mistakes makes his whole Be A Dude act hypocritical at best.


At least with TOB, there was hope heading into the season, the same can't be said with Daz

Anyone saying TOB > Daz is an idiot, if only because they had the exact same record after 4 years and we haven't seen what Daz years 5-10 are like. In fact, it's even more idiotic because all you can say for sure is that TOB was DEFINITELY MEDIOCRE. Daz is LIKELY MEDIOCRE and POSSIBLE TERRIBLE. Anyone championing a certifiably mediocre coach like TOB is pathetic.

Anyone clamoring for Daz or TOB is stupid. And I can't comment on the general optimism or lack thereof surrounding the program during the time of the betting scandal but some general observations below.

I think heading into year 5 TOB was a potentially good to mediocre coach where as Daz is a potentially mediocre coach to an awful one, that is a big difference in their abilities, much bigger than you note.

Both TOB and Daz were inheriting less than ideal situations when hired, with TOB getting handed the betting scandal, not easy to recruit off of that. TOB, however, showed much greater promise than Daz did entering year 5 as he was coming off of years 3 and 4 totaling 15 wins, opposed to Daz' years 3 and 4 totaling 10 wins.

Furthermore, unlike Daz who is scrambling for a QB entering his 5th year and is coming off of 2 conference wins combined during his 3rd and 4th years at the helm, TOB had the ship headed in the right direction in YEAR 3 (remember, Daz went 3-9 with wins over Howard, Maine and NIU in his year 3). In year 3 for TOB, he got to 8 regular season wins, beating #25 ND on the road and only losing to Miami by 3 points at the U (think of all the blowouts in Daz' year 4). TOB's year 4 was followed up by the 7 win season that you mentioned, Brian St. Pierre's first season at the helm thus a step back wouldn't be that surprising. The next year, TOB's year 5, St Pierre had already started a year and eventually led the team to 9 total wins and a final ranking of #21 in the AP top 25.

In year 3-4 TOB had 15 combined wins and his QB of the future already had started a full season entering year 5.

In year 3-4 Daz has 10 combined wins and is entering year 5 without a proven commodity at QB, not good. Daz will be lucky to get to 6 wins in his year 5 which will prove that he is bad (worse than mediocre), where as TOB showed true promise in year 5.

TobaccoRoadEagle {l Wrote}:Tobias had us ranked or at least "also receiving votes" more often than not. has ts slaughter ever received votes (other than the bottom 10?). Tobias could lose an unexpected game every year, but kaptain katsup has some games you know we'll get blown out... even when runnng the prevent offense.

I hated Tobias as much as the next guy but I'd take him back over the current apeman