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chuckiedukes {l Wrote}:In this day and age I think it's impossible to "badly misread fans." I don't buy that. There are too many fan blogs and other outlets that BB could monitor --unless he lives in a digital cave.

Also, if he was unclear about likely fan reaction, he could've floated Addazio's name in the media as a trial balloon. Instead we got rumors of Diaco, Golden, Kromer, Lembo and all sorts of hot NFL names. If you want Addazio, you float other deflating names like Murphy, McDonnell, Clawson, Turner to the media to make Dazzler sound like the best of the bunch.

Truth must be that the 4-7 Dazzler was BB's guy all along. Combined with his Treadwell hire, that scares the shit out of me.

I'll wait to be Dazzled by his superior recruiting skills, and I'm encouraged by the Don Brown hire, but there's not a soul on this planet that can sell me on Spaz retreads like Ryan Day and Bill McGovern on staff after the shit I just watched for four years.

Temple's HC search was better. Finalists were Rhule (Giants assistant OL coach), Diaco, Cristobal, Bowles (Philly Eagles DC), D'onofrio, and Heater. Temple AD put together that list in a week. BB had since the Army game. Pathetic.

What? I don't agree with any of this? McGovern was extremely successful as linebacker coach before Spaz and was probably our best recruiter.

You like the MATT RHULE hire???? Come on man. Todd Bowles probably isn't able to step into philly after his Eagles debacle, nevermind coach a team in philly. Chuck Heater is 60 years old without a previous head coaching gig. Diaco wasn't a confirmed candidate. Cristobal is probably who they should have picked, but he fell into their lap when he was randomly fired (he would have gotten a look from BC if he was jobless when we were hiring).

PS. Call it a coaching search, but the players wanted Matt Rhule the second Addazio was fired, it wasn't a great search by any means

Fair enough, but it's friggin' Temple.

I would say USF, which is a crappier job than BC, ran a better search with Chad Morris, Mike MacIntyre and Willie Taggert as candidates.

chuckiedukes {l Wrote}:In this day and age I think it's impossible to "badly misread fans." I don't buy that. There are too many fan blogs and other outlets that BB could monitor --unless he lives in a digital cave.

Also, if he was unclear about likely fan reaction, he could've floated Addazio's name in the media as a trial balloon. Instead we got rumors of Diaco, Golden, Kromer, Lembo and all sorts of hot NFL names. If you want Addazio, you float other deflating names like Murphy, McDonnell, Clawson, Turner to the media to make Dazzler sound like the best of the bunch.

Truth must be that the 4-7 Dazzler was BB's guy all along. Combined with his Treadwell hire, that scares the shit out of me.

I don't want an AD who bases his decisions on blogs or message boards. That said, if Bates was looking at the blogs and message boards, what he would see is us talking about getting someone who could (a) sell the program, (b) recruit and (c) energize the team and the fanbase. Bates... would've thought Daz, Daz, Daz. We weren't panning Daziani or Clawson or McDonnell or Murphy because no one thought they were real candidates. So, instead we get people killing me for having the temerity of suggesting a "bad fit" like Mark Hudspeth and Sonny Dykes.

I agree 100%... Bates should have floated Daz's name. Absolutely ridiculous he didn't. Just terrible mismanagement on his part. Really calls into question his PR skills. You do not blindside the fanbase unless you were going to announce BOB or Golden.

I also agree that The Dazzler was BB's guy all along. He tried to hire him at Miami and failed. BC tried to hire him instead of Spaz and things didn't work out. Leo Sullivan and the idiots on the BOT had vetted Daz and were happy about his candidacy. Daz actually had a solid start to his season (which is probably when BB was interviewing for BC and offering Daz as his "ideal" Spazoo replacement).

HJS {l Wrote}:

chuckiedukes {l Wrote}:In this day and age I think it's impossible to "badly misread fans." I don't buy that. There are too many fan blogs and other outlets that BB could monitor --unless he lives in a digital cave.

Also, if he was unclear about likely fan reaction, he could've floated Addazio's name in the media as a trial balloon. Instead we got rumors of Diaco, Golden, Kromer, Lembo and all sorts of hot NFL names. If you want Addazio, you float other deflating names like Murphy, McDonnell, Clawson, Turner to the media to make Dazzler sound like the best of the bunch.

Truth must be that the 4-7 Dazzler was BB's guy all along. Combined with his Treadwell hire, that scares the shit out of me.

BC tried to hire him instead of Spaz and things didn't work out. .

We did? You mean if not for his knee injury we could have had Daz instead of Spaz?

Think Brown is D-Coordinator and secondary coach.

DomingoOrtiz {l Wrote}:

HJS {l Wrote}:

chuckiedukes {l Wrote}:In this day and age I think it's impossible to "badly misread fans." I don't buy that. There are too many fan blogs and other outlets that BB could monitor --unless he lives in a digital cave.

Also, if he was unclear about likely fan reaction, he could've floated Addazio's name in the media as a trial balloon. Instead we got rumors of Diaco, Golden, Kromer, Lembo and all sorts of hot NFL names. If you want Addazio, you float other deflating names like Murphy, McDonnell, Clawson, Turner to the media to make Dazzler sound like the best of the bunch.

Truth must be that the 4-7 Dazzler was BB's guy all along. Combined with his Treadwell hire, that scares the shit out of me.

BC tried to hire him instead of Spaz and things didn't work out. .

We did? You mean if not for his knee injury we could have had Daz instead of Spaz?

From what I hear, BC went very far down the road of vetting Daz. The interview never happened because of the complications he developed after his knee surgery (staph?). Who knows if GDF would've ultimately offered. The BOT on the "search committee" and Leo Sullivan were all on board with rewarding Frank for his loyalty. But, they also got very comfortable with Daz.

So... when Bates offered up Daz as someone he would explore bringing to BC, those same people were already on board.

31southst {l Wrote}:

HJS {l Wrote}:First... it's "The Dazzler" (trademark 74).
Second... the Flynn Fund donations have not been what they would be pre-announcement. For the Athletic Development group, it was a big lost opportunity.

Bates listened to the wrong people and badly misread the fans. He has to live with that now. He'll likely try to win back goodwill by tackling the low-hanging fruit that GDF stubbornly ignored (tailgating, student seating in Conte, lacrosse, etc.). My hope is that IF (and that's a big IF) he gets the chance to hire another football coach, he will not ignore the advice given by true fans and ignore the "We Are What We Are" Board members like marin. There is also a possibility that, based upon the fan reaction, Bates will have a quicker trigger on Daz.

Is your commentary re: Bates realizing that the reaction to the Daz hire is anywhere from lukewarm to disappointed purely your thoughts or based on anything concrete you've heard?

I posted it before... but Bates was shocked... blindsided... overwhelmed... by the negative response he immediately received from the fans. He's all into social media and supposedly Twitter did a number on him.

chuckiedukes {l Wrote}:Truth must be that the 4-7 Dazzler was BB's guy all along. Combined with his Treadwell hire, that scares the shit out of me.

I'll wait to be Dazzled by his superior recruiting skills, and I'm encouraged by the Don Brown hire, but there's not a soul on this planet that can sell me on Spaz retreads like Ryan Day and Bill McGovern on staff after the shit I just watched for four years.

Temple's HC search was better. Finalists were Rhule (Giants assistant OL coach), Diaco, Cristobal, Bowles (Philly Eagles DC), D'onofrio, and Heater. Temple AD put together that list in a week. BB had since the Army game. Pathetic.

I don't understand the similarity in the Addazzio and Treadwell hirings at all, but I could be forgetting something utterly. If so what am I forgetting? Also Treadwell, while an awful BC hire is not even close to an awful Miami Ohio hire (on paper- he was an OC at a decent Big10 program under Antonio).

If you hate McGovern the DC its hard to argue with you, if you hate McGovern the LB coach its hard to agree with you. As I said in an earlier post, McGovern may never be able to go home again

Our list was much better than that Temple list, which is kind of the problem.

If it is Albert, it would fit the clues given by JR on TOS. Knows the area, but he's also from NJ, and would be a diversity hire.

If not Albert, it could be Tyree Foreman who was Recruiting Coordinator and RBs coach for Dazzler at Temple, I think.

HJS {l Wrote}:

chuckiedukes {l Wrote}:In this day and age I think it's impossible to "badly misread fans." I don't buy that. There are too many fan blogs and other outlets that BB could monitor --unless he lives in a digital cave.

Also, if he was unclear about likely fan reaction, he could've floated Addazio's name in the media as a trial balloon. Instead we got rumors of Diaco, Golden, Kromer, Lembo and all sorts of hot NFL names. If you want Addazio, you float other deflating names like Murphy, McDonnell, Clawson, Turner to the media to make Dazzler sound like the best of the bunch.

Truth must be that the 4-7 Dazzler was BB's guy all along. Combined with his Treadwell hire, that scares the shit out of me.

I don't want an AD who bases his decisions on blogs or message boards. That said, if Bates was looking at the blogs and message boards, what he would see is us talking about getting someone who could (a) sell the program, (b) recruit and (c) energize the team and the fanbase. Bates... would've thought Daz, Daz, Daz. We weren't panning Daziani or Clawson or McDonnell or Murphy because no one thought they were real candidates. So, instead we get people killing me for having the temerity of suggesting a "bad fit" like Mark Hudspeth and Sonny Dykes.

I agree 100%... Bates should have floated Daz's name. Absolutely ridiculous he didn't. Just terrible mismanagement on his part. Really calls into question his PR skills. You do not blindside the fanbase unless you were going to announce BOB or Golden.

I also agree that The Dazzler was BB's guy all along. He tried to hire him at Miami and failed. BC tried to hire him instead of Spaz and things didn't work out. Leo Sullivan and the idiots on the BOT had vetted Daz and were happy about his candidacy. Daz actually had a solid start to his season (which is probably when BB was interviewing for BC and offering Daz as his "ideal" Spazoo replacement).

Where did the Bates tried to hire Addazio at Miami rumor come from? I think its the first I've heard of this.

BTW, if Addazio was a good candidate when he was 3-2 in early October playing with Goldens players (I mention this because it doesn't show anything about Addazio's recruiting in either direction), then he was a good candidate after the doors fell off. I really cannot reiterate enough how bad Temple's depth and overall talent is. The final product is actually similar, but a significant degree worse, to what Spaz has done to BC. Unlike BC however, it is somewhat amazing that Golden and one class of Addazio are able to get to being a very shallow BigEast team, whereas Spaz ruining BC is something else entirely. Temple graduated over 1/2 of their starting 2011 defense, they lost two nfl draft picks including the best (maybe second to Palmer) player in school history and moved up a level. That is a lot to overcome.

Finally, our "fan base" that you refer to isn't really a thing in the way you are describing. We care how this went down, but do you really know other people that do? My anecdotal experience has been that more casual BC "fans" are not excited about Addazio and they might have been with another name (the part of your point I agree with), and they may have heard that Diaco interviewed but know nothing of Roman, Carmichael, etc. and certainly weren't thinking about a list of good fits from the sun belt who weren't candidates in any manner other than they might have been good BC coaches. So for them it wasn't the shock of not hiring a big name because we though we might (most casual fans I know are at a level of expecting terribleness at all times at this point), it was more just a lack of enthusiasm in a 4-7 coach from Temple.

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:Where did the Bates tried to hire Addazio at Miami rumor come from? I think its the first I've heard of this.

It came from Bates through a number of his interviews. I think he mentioned it in that YouTube video the fateful night the press release went out. I also think he mentioned it on that WEEI show he did afterward.

It wasn’t for lack of interest. Addazio had been on Bates’s list for years, going back to Bates’s days at Miami University and Addazio’s days as an assistant to Urban Meyer on two national championship teams at Florida
http://www.boston.com/sports/colleges/f ... story.html

And then Bates went back in his memory bank a few years to when he was looking for a new coach at Miami of Ohio and went after Addazio, who was then on Urban Meyer’s staff at Florida and was regarded as one of the top assistants in college football. Addazio balked at the move, feeling that he was ready to take over a program at a school from one of the six BCS conferences.
http://ajerseyguy.com/?p=4066

HJS {l Wrote}:

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:Where did the Bates tried to hire Addazio at Miami rumor come from? I think its the first I've heard of this.

It came from Bates through a number of his interviews. I think he mentioned it in that YouTube video the fateful night the press release went out. I also think he mentioned it on that WEEI show he did afterward.

It wasn’t for lack of interest. Addazio had been on Bates’s list for years, going back to Bates’s days at Miami University and Addazio’s days as an assistant to Urban Meyer on two national championship teams at Florida
http://www.boston.com/sports/colleges/f ... story.html

And then Bates went back in his memory bank a few years to when he was looking for a new coach at Miami of Ohio and went after Addazio, who was then on Urban Meyer’s staff at Florida and was regarded as one of the top assistants in college football. Addazio balked at the move, feeling that he was ready to take over a program at a school from one of the six BCS conferences.
http://ajerseyguy.com/?p=4066

I forgot about that.

The Daziani hire is one made by a school that just wants to be 6-6, 7-5, make a shit bowl, and cash the BCS conference checks. Someone who will not make waves, and just beat MD, NCSU, Wake, etc enough times to keep the stadium full.

The real people who run the school do not want to bring in a big time coach who is going to come in and say "what the fuck is going on here", and use his gravitas to start changing shit around.

As a huge Ranger fan, bringing in Messier (the first time) was the type of move that should have been made. He came in and changed ALOT of things, both big and small, and didn't give a shit about who wasn't happy about it. He said "I'm Mark fucking Messier. You brought me in to win a Cup, so STFU and do it my way". The people who run BC are petrified of this. I swear, if Urban Meyer, before OSU, approached BC and said "I'm a devoted Catholic, I have always liked your school and how you do things, I can win here, and my health requires me to be able to coach in an environment where I am not a combination of Elvis and Justin Beeber", BC would have found a way to show him the door.

Reading between the lines, it looks like Ben Albert will be BCs Dline coach. He has a very good resume and I suspect he's a good recruiter too. BCs Dline is such a mess that even getting that group to average will quite an accomplishment. There's no where to go but up from a lofty 6 sack total from last years epically futile pass rush.

HJS {l Wrote}:

31southst {l Wrote}:

HJS {l Wrote}:First... it's "The Dazzler" (trademark 74).
Second... the Flynn Fund donations have not been what they would be pre-announcement. For the Athletic Development group, it was a big lost opportunity.

Bates listened to the wrong people and badly misread the fans. He has to live with that now. He'll likely try to win back goodwill by tackling the low-hanging fruit that GDF stubbornly ignored (tailgating, student seating in Conte, lacrosse, etc.). My hope is that IF (and that's a big IF) he gets the chance to hire another football coach, he will not ignore the advice given by true fans and ignore the "We Are What We Are" Board members like marin. There is also a possibility that, based upon the fan reaction, Bates will have a quicker trigger on Daz.

Is your commentary re: Bates realizing that the reaction to the Daz hire is anywhere from lukewarm to disappointed purely your thoughts or based on anything concrete you've heard?

I posted it before... but Bates was shocked... blindsided... overwhelmed... by the negative response he immediately received from the fans. He's all into social media and supposedly Twitter did a number on him.

All you had to do was look at Bates at the Dazzler presser to know what the response was. He looked like he had been through the ringer at that point.

Oliver Closeoff {l Wrote}:Reading between the lines, it looks like Ben Albert will be BCs Dline coach. He has a very good resume and I suspect he's a good recruiter too. BCs Dline is such a mess that even getting that group to average will quite an accomplishment. There's no where to go but up from a lofty 6 sack total from last years epically futile pass rush.

If it is Ben Albert and Commish and Big Al Washington have already been handed their walking papers, why all the silence? An assistant following his coach to a new program doesn't require secrecy.

HJS {l Wrote}:

Oliver Closeoff {l Wrote}:Reading between the lines, it looks like Ben Albert will be BCs Dline coach. He has a very good resume and I suspect he's a good recruiter too. BCs Dline is such a mess that even getting that group to average will quite an accomplishment. There's no where to go but up from a lofty 6 sack total from last years epically futile pass rush.

If it is Ben Albert and Commish and Big Al Washington have already been handed their walking papers, why all the silence? An assistant following his coach to a new program doesn't require secrecy.

a poster on EA said he read that it was Albert on the "front page of the Temple Football site" but I don't know what he means and can't find anything like that. He may be extrapolating from the hire of Noble as Temple's new DL coach. I don't know.

All you had to do was look at Bates at the Dazzler presser to know what the response was. He looked like he had been through the ringer at that point.

Bates has been a lot quieter on Twitter since the announcement. Whether or not that was related to the hire is conjecture but I think it's a reasonable assumption that he got hit pretty hard.

HJS {l Wrote}:

Oliver Closeoff {l Wrote}:Reading between the lines, it looks like Ben Albert will be BCs Dline coach. He has a very good resume and I suspect he's a good recruiter too. BCs Dline is such a mess that even getting that group to average will quite an accomplishment. There's no where to go but up from a lofty 6 sack total from last years epically futile pass rush.

If it is Ben Albert and Commish and Big Al Washington have already been handed their walking papers, why all the silence? An assistant following his coach to a new program doesn't require secrecy.

I'm guessing that BC wants to announce the remaining position coaches at one time. JR from EA did confirm that the new DLs name was mentioned in the thread. Pepper Johnson(unlikely), NC states Willis(someone said no) and Ben Albert were the only people named.

Oliver Closeoff {l Wrote}:

HJS {l Wrote}:

Oliver Closeoff {l Wrote}:Reading between the lines, it looks like Ben Albert will be BCs Dline coach. He has a very good resume and I suspect he's a good recruiter too. BCs Dline is such a mess that even getting that group to average will quite an accomplishment. There's no where to go but up from a lofty 6 sack total from last years epically futile pass rush.

If it is Ben Albert and Commish and Big Al Washington have already been handed their walking papers, why all the silence? An assistant following his coach to a new program doesn't require secrecy.

I'm guessing that BC wants to announce the remaining position coaches at one time. JR from EA did confirm that the new DLs name was mentioned in the thread. Pepper Johnson(unlikely), NC states Willis(someone said no) and Ben Albert were the only people named.

They can do whatever the heck they like. But, they've already made separate press releases announcing the hirings of Day, Brown, McGovern, Frye and Leonard. Don't know why the need to now only release one more.

Albert CONFIRMED

Press release says Albert recruited Victor Cruz at UMass, which means maybe he'll be another NJ area recruiter along with McGovern.

Looks like they might keep Washington. http://instagram.com/p/UFFKeHrlK2/ Pretty sure that second from the left has his name on the top left corner of that envelope.

Ben Albert hire does nothing for me.

DavidGordonsFoot {l Wrote}:Ben Albert hire does nothing for me.

why not?

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:

DavidGordonsFoot {l Wrote}:Ben Albert hire does nothing for me.

why not?

maybe albert's a eunuch

I've actually been pretty happy with the assistant hires thus far. Washington is the only BC staffer I was hoping we would keep. Other than that, it is nice to see that we are cleaning house.

Shaddix {l Wrote}:Looks like they might keep Washington. http://instagram.com/p/UFFKeHrlK2/ Pretty sure that second from the left has his name on the top left corner of that envelope.

I wouldnt say just based on a letter he addressed in a pile that it means they might be keeping him. Ive seen letters like that with his name a while back as well (addressed to Ntantang). Im not saying yes or no either way, it would obviosly make a ton of sense to have a young, black, FB alumni on staff, but I wouldnt read into a letter on instagram and say it looks like they may keep him.

BCSUPERFAN22 {l Wrote}:

Shaddix {l Wrote}:Looks like they might keep Washington. http://instagram.com/p/UFFKeHrlK2/ Pretty sure that second from the left has his name on the top left corner of that envelope.

I wouldnt say just based on a letter he addressed in a pile that it means they might be keeping him. Ive seen letters like that with his name a while back as well (addressed to Ntantang). Im not saying yes or no either way, it would obviosly make a ton of sense to have a young, black, FB alumni on staff, but I wouldnt read into a letter on instagram and say it looks like they may keep him.

I would, I didn't say anything was definite, but I can only see it as a good sign. At this point, Addazio should have relieved the Spaz staff, maybe one or two are being kept until playoffs or bowls are over or until Heater makes his decision but the fact that his name is still on BC letters on January 4th is a good sign (if you like Washington on the staff and want him back).