Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby Walsh601 on Fri Mar 15, 2013 10:21 pm

TRAVEL COSTS!!1!!!1

The University of Maryland's deal to join the Big Ten includes not only the lucrative annual payouts that all members receive, but also a significant concession obtained by the school — a subsidy worth tens of millions of dollars from the conference to offset athletic teams' anticipated higher travel costs, according to multiple sources.

The subsidy, which Maryland was promised in negotiations with the conference late last year, made an already appealing offer of Big Ten membership even more attractive to the school.

Since financial details of the agreement are kept private — the amount of the subsidy is not publicly available. But the amount is in the range of $20 million to $30 million, according to sources familiar with the deal.


http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/terps/bs-sp-terps-big-ten-travel-0315-20130314,0,1297978.story
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby DrJackRyan on Sat Mar 16, 2013 8:38 am

I think this has been posted before but I had forgotten about it. Amazing "what could have been".

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The idea was to create a super conference of 16 schools overlapping states from the Northeast through the South. Eventually, according to this plan, there would be four super conferences that blanketed the country, and their champions would come together in a playoff to decide the national champ in college football.


History lesson: Super-conference concept rooted in 1990 proposal
By Michael Smith, Staff Writer
Published September 26, 2011, Page 1

http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2011/09/26/Colleges/Super-conference.aspx

The only reason Penn State was out (and Temple in, I assume) was that they had just committed to the Big Ten.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby JesuitIvy on Sat Mar 16, 2013 10:38 am

Wild how forward-thinking that proposal was -- I read the full Raycom write up of it - you can find it online if you google -- must be how I found it. It's moot, but Miami was so focused on having northern exposure then I doubt they would have gone for being in a southern division unless they had BC as a cross over of some regular trips north. Interesting too how no ACC teams were in that proposal -- they were a tight group.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby HJS on Wed Mar 20, 2013 5:07 pm

This may be the only thing that would curtail future conference expansion.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/cable-tv- ... video.html
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby dtwalrus on Wed Mar 20, 2013 7:16 pm

HJS {l Wrote}:This may be the only thing that would curtail future conference expansion.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/cable-tv- ... video.html


Nobody outside the Midwest is paying $1-$3 for the BigTen Network if a la carte cable ever comes to pass. In fact, if its not part of an automatic package, consumers who do actually opt for individual channels would probably need to pay more, maybe even $5-10 per channel. That certainly would give pause to expansion.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby pick6pedro on Wed Mar 20, 2013 7:32 pm

dtwalrus {l Wrote}:
HJS {l Wrote}:This may be the only thing that would curtail future conference expansion.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/cable-tv- ... video.html


Nobody outside the Midwest is paying $1-$3 for the BigTen Network if a la carte cable ever comes to pass. In fact, if its not part of an automatic package, consumers who do actually opt for individual channels would probably need to pay more, maybe even $5-10 per channel. That certainly would give pause to expansion.


All I know is a ton of channels would disappear...and no one would notice.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby hansen on Wed Mar 20, 2013 9:13 pm

I would love for the laws of supply/demand to apply to cable tv. I pay a ridiculous amount each month for cable and I probably watch ten channels max.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby dtwalrus on Wed Mar 20, 2013 9:14 pm

pick6pedro {l Wrote}:
dtwalrus {l Wrote}:
HJS {l Wrote}:This may be the only thing that would curtail future conference expansion.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/cable-tv- ... video.html


Nobody outside the Midwest is paying $1-$3 for the BigTen Network if a la carte cable ever comes to pass. In fact, if its not part of an automatic package, consumers who do actually opt for individual channels would probably need to pay more, maybe even $5-10 per channel. That certainly would give pause to expansion.


All I know is a ton of channels would disappear...and no one would notice.


A mediocre paycheck from ESPN, arguably the only truly indispensable cable channel, could suddenly look like a windfall for the ACC.

Now it's crazy talk. :screamyeagle
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby HJS on Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:16 am

I've said elsewhere in this thread that the current cable model is simply not sustainable. Cable companies have seen their customer base shrink as competition from phone companies like ATT & Verizon and Satellite TV (Dish and Direct) has taken a sizeable chunk of their market. Further, cable companies (which used to have a monopoly for each area) are now directly competing against each other. Their profit margins have moved to zero as a result. In spite of that, everyone's cable bill continues to rise. This is directly linked to the "packaging" mandated by the network providers. You want NBC? Well, you need to pay an equal amount for NBCSports, ID, HGN, etc. You want to watch ABC? Well you need to pay equally for a suite of Disney Channels, El Ocho and double for the SEC Network.

If everything remained the same, the model could survive as every time a cable company was being held hostage, they would cave and simply pass the additional $10 a month that FOX raped out of them to pay for Maryland and Rutgers in the Big Ten directly onto each customer. However, cable companies are now fealing the immense pressure that is the future of TV... direct access/on demand. Apple TV, Hulu, Netflix, ESPN3 are all changing the way people watch TV. In the very near future, cable companies fear that they will no longer be in the TV delivery business as folks will opt to watch everything streamed. That is why Cablevision has chosen this moment to fight this battle. Their customers have no interest paying $100 a month for 500 stations that they rarely use. They want the ability to offer cut-rate packages that offer nothing but basic cable. They want customers to be able to pay for packages (e.g. a Sports Package) if they want to receive the eleventy billion sports-specific TV shows.

The reality is that regardless of the outcome of the case, I still maintain that the current model is not sustainable and believe we have reached the tipping point that will lead to its downfall. If Cablevision succeeds, you will see many more stations jumping onto streaming services (as they will otherwise find themselves off the air). If Cablevision fails, they model will collapse as market realities take hold (ever-increasing supply of alternative ways to deliver and watch TV, combined with weakening demand to pay for ever-increasing cable costs for viewing opportunities that are NEVER utilized).

As it relates to expansion... I'm not 100% certain. Universities are largely run by government administrators. They are essential just another politician (see the entire Obama administration). With fears of "being left behind", a shrinking donation base caused by the Oconomy, an evaporation of revenues provided by the State and a constant desire to pridefully keep up with the Joneses, Universities feel immense pressure to acquiesce to the whims of their alumni and fans. Expansion is not being governed by reason and this lawsuit does not mean that these real-life failure will start acting rationally (though I hope it gives at least a few of them pause). It should also be noted that Delany also sold Maryland on the Big Ten's ability to stream games. There was an article somewhere along the line where MD's President was talking about how Delany envisions people not buying tickets to attend games... but buying tickets to watch it on TV. So, it seems that he has contemplated the future... and yet still strangely chose to add Maryland and Rutgers.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby eagle9903 on Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:22 am

hasn't a la carte cable been on the horizon forever?
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby HJS on Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:47 am

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:hasn't a la carte cable been on the horizon forever?

Yes... just like conference expansion has been on the horizon forever, so has a la carte cable. But, just like conference expansion, I think the time is finally here. Until now, there hasn't been any real incentive to make a major change as customers were basically had no where else to go. It was much easier for the cable companies to keep passing the costs directly onto them. But, the burgeoning streaming market has finally caused the cable companies to fight back... which is why Cablevision is doing this now, as opposed to 10 years ago.

It should be noted that Steve Jobs wanted to have Apple move into the living room years ago. However, he did not feel it was practical at the time as the cable companies owned too much of the content. He had been working on getting more and more networks to offer streaming alternatives. Hulu and Netflix have greatly pushed this process along. Apple TV has been a very long project for the company, but the company only ramped it up in the last days of Jobs. Analysts say it is coming to market in 2014.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby b0mberMan on Thu Mar 21, 2013 9:55 am

HJS {l Wrote}:I've said elsewhere in this thread that the current cable model is simply not sustainable.

Timestamp this for when HJS tells us all he was right all along when the current cable model changes.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby hansen on Thu Mar 21, 2013 10:52 am

HJS {l Wrote}:
eagle9903 {l Wrote}:hasn't a la carte cable been on the horizon forever?

Yes... just like conference expansion has been on the horizon forever, so has a la carte cable. But, just like conference expansion, I think the time is finally here. Until now, there hasn't been any real incentive to make a major change as customers were basically had no where else to go. It was much easier for the cable companies to keep passing the costs directly onto them. But, the burgeoning streaming market has finally caused the cable companies to fight back... which is why Cablevision is doing this now, as opposed to 10 years ago.

It should be noted that Steve Jobs wanted to have Apple move into the living room years ago. However, he did not feel it was practical at the time as the cable companies owned too much of the content. He had been working on getting more and more networks to offer streaming alternatives. Hulu and Netflix have greatly pushed this process along. Apple TV has been a very long project for the company, but the company only ramped it up in the last days of Jobs. Analysts say it is coming to market in 2014.


It's actually been reported by analysts to be late 2013
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby TobaccoRoadEagle on Thu Mar 21, 2013 10:55 am

shut up, hansen
now in the street there is violence
and, and a lots of work to be done
no place to hang out our washing
and, and i can't blame all on the sun
good god we gonna rock down to electric avenue
and then we'll take it higher
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby HJS on Thu Mar 21, 2013 1:36 pm

hansen {l Wrote}:
HJS {l Wrote}:
eagle9903 {l Wrote}:hasn't a la carte cable been on the horizon forever?

Yes... just like conference expansion has been on the horizon forever, so has a la carte cable. But, just like conference expansion, I think the time is finally here. Until now, there hasn't been any real incentive to make a major change as customers were basically had no where else to go. It was much easier for the cable companies to keep passing the costs directly onto them. But, the burgeoning streaming market has finally caused the cable companies to fight back... which is why Cablevision is doing this now, as opposed to 10 years ago.

It should be noted that Steve Jobs wanted to have Apple move into the living room years ago. However, he did not feel it was practical at the time as the cable companies owned too much of the content. He had been working on getting more and more networks to offer streaming alternatives. Hulu and Netflix have greatly pushed this process along. Apple TV has been a very long project for the company, but the company only ramped it up in the last days of Jobs. Analysts say it is coming to market in 2014.


It's actually been reported by analysts to be late 2013

http://www.sfgate.com/technology/busine ... 347942.php
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby twballgame9 on Thu Mar 21, 2013 1:38 pm

Apple TV is guaranteed to be twice as expensive and half as good as cable, but three times more popular in the ever important 18-35 year old female category.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby JesuitIvy on Thu Mar 21, 2013 1:47 pm

Stunning stat I read recently -- cable companies in the US as a group have posted a net loss of customers the past 9 years running. They're going to pull out all the stops to block a la carte, b/c sports are one of the few things that get people to stick with them
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby hansen on Thu Mar 21, 2013 2:01 pm

twballgame9 {l Wrote}:Apple TV is guaranteed to be twice as expensive and half as good as cable, but three times more popular in the ever important 18-35 year old female category.


As long as people keep buying their shit and the stock goes up, i am happy.

disclosure. i own an ipod/ipad and use an iphone for work which i did not purchase.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby eagle9903 on Thu Mar 21, 2013 2:28 pm

I think an important issue will be whether the sports programming on apple tv is blacked out locally like it would be if you were to purchase NHL Gamecenter or I think MLB TV for your computer.

Huluplus already has pretty great selection of shows and seems to be improving as time goes on.

It will also be interesting to see if you can get things like HBO to go for it. I would think not.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby RegalBCeagle on Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:07 pm

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:I think an important issue will be whether the sports programming on apple tv is blacked out locally like it would be if you were to purchase NHL Gamecenter or I think MLB TV for your computer.

Huluplus already has pretty great selection of shows and seems to be improving as time goes on.

It will also be interesting to see if you can get things like HBO to go for it. I would think not.


If it wasn't for the Series that HBO produces, I wouldn't carry the premium channels on my package. I've recently been re-watching The Sopranos on HBO GO, and plan on watching The Wire from the start - a show I only partially followed. On Demand type watching is the future of TV and Movie watching. The only thing keeping networks relevant is live sports, and perhaps real-time shows. If others are like me, I'll DVR a show and start watching it about half-way through so that I can fast forward through commercials and just about catch up at the end of the show. It'll be interesting to see the evolution of TV, and how that impacts sports including conference realignment.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby shockdoct on Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:23 pm

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:I think an important issue will be whether the sports programming on apple tv is blacked out locally like it would be if you were to purchase NHL Gamecenter or I think MLB TV for your computer.

Huluplus already has pretty great selection of shows and seems to be improving as time goes on.

It will also be interesting to see if you can get things like HBO to go for it. I would think not.


Question around the blackouts will depend on the sports leagues and the agreements with their cable partners.

I think you will always have the local tv blackouts of online streams so the local tv networks can collect their cash from their local consumers.
The bigger question will be around the national tv blackouts.

In terms of "national" broadcast blackouts, you can go down two different avenues.

On one hand you have MLB.TV which only blacks out Saturday afternoon (3-4 games usually) and Sunday Night baseball (1 game) each week. MLB.tv does not currently blackout weekday ESPN games, the weekly TBS game, or anything broadcast on MLB Network (own broadcast/production of games or simulcasts of a local affiliate's feed). Thus MLB.tv is a great option if you live outside of your teams market.

Then you have NHL which has gone full retard. The NHL Gamecenter online package not only blacks out the weekly NBC game (defensible) and every single NBC SportsNetwork game (quasi understandable), but in addition blacks out a game where NHL Network is just retransmitting a local networks feed (flat out atrocious)

So if you are a fan of a decent team that the NHL loves to put on the national broadcasts (NBC, NBCSN, NHLN), you can watch maybe 40% of the team's games live if you have cut the cord and don't have cable anymore.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby eagle9903 on Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:27 pm

shockdoct {l Wrote}:
eagle9903 {l Wrote}:I think an important issue will be whether the sports programming on apple tv is blacked out locally like it would be if you were to purchase NHL Gamecenter or I think MLB TV for your computer.

Huluplus already has pretty great selection of shows and seems to be improving as time goes on.

It will also be interesting to see if you can get things like HBO to go for it. I would think not.


Question around the blackouts will depend on the sports leagues and the agreements with their cable partners.

I think you will always have the local tv blackouts of online streams so the local tv networks can collect their cash from their local consumers.
The bigger question will be around the national tv blackouts.

In terms of "national" broadcast blackouts, you can go down two different avenues.

On one hand you have MLB.TV which only blacks out Saturday afternoon (3-4 games usually) and Sunday Night baseball (1 game) each week. MLB.tv does not currently blackout weekday ESPN games, the weekly TBS game, or anything broadcast on MLB Network (own broadcast/production of games or simulcasts of a local affiliate's feed). Thus MLB.tv is a great option if you live outside of your teams market.

Then you have NHL which has gone full retard. The NHL Gamecenter online package not only blacks out the weekly NBC game (defensible) and every single NBC SportsNetwork game (quasi understandable), but in addition blacks out a game where NHL Network is just retransmitting a local networks feed (flat out atrocious)

So if you are a fan of a decent team that the NHL loves to put on the national broadcasts (NBC, NBCSN, NHLN), you can watch maybe 40% of the team's games live if you have cut the cord and don't have cable anymore.


I was thinking more along the lines of an antitrust issue. I don't think it applies everywhere, but I think and I'm not looking this up so could be very wrong, that comcast down here was forced to provide its content from comcast sportsnet to the satellite providers and verizon. I can't see why appletv couldn't force its way in too.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby shockdoct on Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:34 pm

While I don't think we will ever see true a la carte pricing, I do think we will see the re-introduction of tiers (esp if the govt gets involved which seems inevitable). Returning to the old days of putting certain sports channels on a tier will become much more desirable to cable companies for retaining customers, especially as the sports channels become such a huge chunk of the ever increasing cable bill. This will be a huge blow to most of the specialized sports networks.

In fact that has already quietly started happening. From a recent WSJ article:

There are already some cheaper packages in the market—but they aren't promoted heavily. Verizon Communications' VZ +0.41%FiOS service recently introduced "Select HD," priced at $49.99 a month, about $15 below the next-level package. Like similar offerings available from other distributors, it excludes sports channels such as ESPN. But operators can't market these too widely for fear of violating contracts with entertainment companies. Those contracts typically require that their channels reach 80% to 90% of their subscribers.


The WSJ has been publishing articles every few days on this subject recently.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby twballgame9 on Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:36 pm

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:
shockdoct {l Wrote}:
eagle9903 {l Wrote}:I think an important issue will be whether the sports programming on apple tv is blacked out locally like it would be if you were to purchase NHL Gamecenter or I think MLB TV for your computer.

Huluplus already has pretty great selection of shows and seems to be improving as time goes on.

It will also be interesting to see if you can get things like HBO to go for it. I would think not.


Question around the blackouts will depend on the sports leagues and the agreements with their cable partners.

I think you will always have the local tv blackouts of online streams so the local tv networks can collect their cash from their local consumers.
The bigger question will be around the national tv blackouts.

In terms of "national" broadcast blackouts, you can go down two different avenues.

On one hand you have MLB.TV which only blacks out Saturday afternoon (3-4 games usually) and Sunday Night baseball (1 game) each week. MLB.tv does not currently blackout weekday ESPN games, the weekly TBS game, or anything broadcast on MLB Network (own broadcast/production of games or simulcasts of a local affiliate's feed). Thus MLB.tv is a great option if you live outside of your teams market.

Then you have NHL which has gone full retard. The NHL Gamecenter online package not only blacks out the weekly NBC game (defensible) and every single NBC SportsNetwork game (quasi understandable), but in addition blacks out a game where NHL Network is just retransmitting a local networks feed (flat out atrocious)

So if you are a fan of a decent team that the NHL loves to put on the national broadcasts (NBC, NBCSN, NHLN), you can watch maybe 40% of the team's games live if you have cut the cord and don't have cable anymore.


I was thinking more along the lines of an antitrust issue. I don't think it applies everywhere, but I think and I'm not looking this up so could be very wrong, that comcast down here was forced to provide its content from comcast sportsnet to the satellite providers and verizon. I can't see why appletv couldn't force its way in too.


It applies everywhere. FCC evidently closed the terrestrial loophole that exempted Comcast Philly from having to upload to satellite. I don't believe Apple TV would be covered by that FCC regs unless they are planning to beam the content via satellite.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby eagle9903 on Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:44 pm

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/50091631/ns/sports/ I don't think this will ultimately change anything, but interesting.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby HJS on Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:55 pm

I have absolutely no idea what Apple TV will be. The easy guess is that it will combine everything out there into one package. By that I mean, Ultra HD, multi-room DVR that also displays on all your Apple devices, built in computer AND streaming content organized brilliantly (Netflix and the like are a mess). But, I don't necessarily think it will be a game changer like iPod, iPhone and iPad were. But, they've surprised before.

As for Cable and the proliferation of antitrust suits, I think that it means the current business model may already be dead.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby Cadillac90 on Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:28 am

The a la carte model will never work. It wouldn't generate enough money to produce the amount of content needed. Cable channels and networks don't know what is the next Modern Family or Duck Dynasty so they have to produce a lot of shows to find the hits. You can't do that with a la carte cable, sorry it'll never happen.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby eagle9903 on Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:42 am

Cadillac90 {l Wrote}:The a la carte model will never work. It wouldn't generate enough money to produce the amount of content needed. Cable channels and networks don't know what is the next Modern Family or Duck Dynasty so they have to produce a lot of shows to find the hits. You can't do that with a la carte cable, sorry it'll never happen.


You're probably right, but I think tiered pricing might expand though.
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby Cadillac90 on Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:46 am

eagle9903 {l Wrote}:
Cadillac90 {l Wrote}:The a la carte model will never work. It wouldn't generate enough money to produce the amount of content needed. Cable channels and networks don't know what is the next Modern Family or Duck Dynasty so they have to produce a lot of shows to find the hits. You can't do that with a la carte cable, sorry it'll never happen.


You're probably right, but I think tiered pricing might expand though.


Agreed
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Re: Maryland may actually be leaving the ACC

Postby b0mberMan on Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:55 am

The new model is already available to some extent and pretty easy to take yourself off the grid if you want. I'm lazy and like being unexpectedly treated to 5 hours of Castle when I least expect it, so I haven't. The question is who will control this - content producers, traditional TV arms, internet providers, hardware manufacturers, or the cable companies themselves.

The big piece of the puzzle is monetizing the content and I think that a provider like Hulu is missing the mark in a big way. Yes, they provide advertising but they provide standard advertising sold in much the same way TV ads are sold. They should be personalizing and targeting their ads based on your personal they have access to a la web advertising. This is a much more responsive form of advertising and people pay for it. Think about if they could bring in re-tartgeting technologies into their mix. You're on tractors.com, looking at a new John Deere, and then you leave the site, go check your bank account, and then fire up an episode. First commercial break, John Deere ads are in front of you, keeping that mindshare.
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